How good is Judo for some good ol ass kickin? Is it valuable at all? Does it only serve as a olympic sport? In my community they're giving free Judo classes, but I dont want to get into something that will be mainly useless... Opinions please?
Judo for Self Defense?
- Thread starter Oblivion02
- Start date
Free Judo classes!!!! get in there!!!!
Mate, Even if it was crap (which its not) I'd go and learn all I could.
as with any martial art or sports martial art its all about the instructer, not the art itself. If your planning on starting fight with a lot of serious martial artist then judo wont help you much.
However, pretty much every time you get 2 non-martial artists fighting, it will end after 1 punch, or it will go to the floor.
Judo is great for controlling your oponent. Some people neglect the art of Judo saying that there is no point in throwing if you can't throw a punch. I say, what the point in learning to punch if you can just throw your oponent down.
It will help you a lot to take a more distanced art as well (like Karate, Kung fu etc...) But judo is great.
Mate, Even if it was crap (which its not) I'd go and learn all I could.
as with any martial art or sports martial art its all about the instructer, not the art itself. If your planning on starting fight with a lot of serious martial artist then judo wont help you much.
However, pretty much every time you get 2 non-martial artists fighting, it will end after 1 punch, or it will go to the floor.
Judo is great for controlling your oponent. Some people neglect the art of Judo saying that there is no point in throwing if you can't throw a punch. I say, what the point in learning to punch if you can just throw your oponent down.
It will help you a lot to take a more distanced art as well (like Karate, Kung fu etc...) But judo is great.
If you are 100% sure that its 1on1 you can take the fight down on the ground, problem is you're never 100% sure. Thats why you normally never want to go for grappling etc. - you never know if his buddies will come and you want to be on your feet for that to go for Muay Thai (Striking) for example. Also its enough that he gets a hand free for a second and you could have a knife in you.
Shooto, thai, MMA.. all good for streetfights but nomatter what style you use the key is timing; to use your adrenaline at the right time, quick and hard - and shock your opponent with "furious anger". No matter what style you train it all still boils down to "how far will i take this", "instinct" and psycholgical barriers - if you meet a crazy **** jacked up on drugs and alcohol who's trying to pick a fight - just get out of there, it will only end with either you or him getting hurt badly and even if you come out on top its not fun to have sent someone to the hospital.
Anyway, dont choose a style based on what will kick the most ass, choose based on what you think is fun! do you like to wrestle? kick? maybe capoeira if you want something that looks cool. And also find a club with cool people!
Shooto, thai, MMA.. all good for streetfights but nomatter what style you use the key is timing; to use your adrenaline at the right time, quick and hard - and shock your opponent with "furious anger". No matter what style you train it all still boils down to "how far will i take this", "instinct" and psycholgical barriers - if you meet a crazy **** jacked up on drugs and alcohol who's trying to pick a fight - just get out of there, it will only end with either you or him getting hurt badly and even if you come out on top its not fun to have sent someone to the hospital.
Anyway, dont choose a style based on what will kick the most ass, choose based on what you think is fun! do you like to wrestle? kick? maybe capoeira if you want something that looks cool. And also find a club with cool people!
I was interested in a more street fight style, more striking rather than grappling, but since they are free, well 
Though it was a good oportunity
Though it was a good oportunity I was discussing this with a friend of mine some time ago. My friend is a police officer, and has been for the last 7 years, and in his opinion Judo is definitely good for self defence.
Why? There are a number of reasons, but here are a few:
1) It allows you a degree of control over the damage you do to an opponent - you can crank up the energy in a technique to do more damage to them.
2) Minimises risk of joint injuries to yourself - a high percentage of injuries resulting from street fights are to the hands of the attacker (usually from impacts to the head or other bony processes)- in judo, this isn't a problem.
3) You actively spar using live techniques with fully resisting opponents (randori).
4) You don't need to be warmed up or flexible to perform the techniques.
5) The techniques work well against trained and untrained opponents, and moving in to grappling range eliminates many striking attacks.
6) There aren't hundred of techniques to learn, just a decent set of effective tools, so you get more practice at the core arts rather than training a little in all sorts of fancy tricks.
7) You can always incorporate striking arts later when you've achieved a decent competency level.
I could keep going, but I think that covers some of the key points...
Why? There are a number of reasons, but here are a few:
1) It allows you a degree of control over the damage you do to an opponent - you can crank up the energy in a technique to do more damage to them.
2) Minimises risk of joint injuries to yourself - a high percentage of injuries resulting from street fights are to the hands of the attacker (usually from impacts to the head or other bony processes)- in judo, this isn't a problem.
3) You actively spar using live techniques with fully resisting opponents (randori).
4) You don't need to be warmed up or flexible to perform the techniques.
5) The techniques work well against trained and untrained opponents, and moving in to grappling range eliminates many striking attacks.
6) There aren't hundred of techniques to learn, just a decent set of effective tools, so you get more practice at the core arts rather than training a little in all sorts of fancy tricks.
7) You can always incorporate striking arts later when you've achieved a decent competency level.
I could keep going, but I think that covers some of the key points...
Yeah I've decided to take Judo because its free, and i realized it does serve well for self defense since your oponent cant really do much if he's caught in a joint-lock or thrown to the ground. And I also realized it has great street fight value because once your oponent is dropped, he is pretty much screwed since you can literally kick the **** out of him. Judo sounds pretty good because I can also control how much damage I do... It has really caught my attention... Im starting next week!
Judo for ass kicking
Dear Oblivion,
Heres a few cool insights to Judo that may interest you.
Judo, although now primarily a sport, was once primarily a defensive grappling art. Modern day Brazilian Jiu Jitsu (BJJ) which has gained world wide recognition from fighters in Mixed Martial Arts competions (like the Ultimate Fighting Championship) was actually derived from Judo. Im sure you've heard of the Gracie's who popularized BJJ, use text book grappling moves from Judo and adapted them to a more street style of fighting in the earlier part of the century. Mitsuyo Maeda, a student of the founder of Judo (Jigaro Kano) brought it to Brazil teaching it to Gaesto Gracie, and the Gracie's refined it as more of a "Ground" style rather than the "throwing" sport that Judo has become. If you ever come across an old school Judo book you will find all the same finishing moves that you see in modern MMA combat (Armbar, chokes, Kimura lock, figure 4, kato gari), but thats up to your Judo instructor if he teaches those or not, and of course how much you train to use it.
Another interesting thing, there is a Chinese art similar to Judo called shuai chao which focussus on throwing techniques such as the ones found in Judo. Shuai chao is designed to disable your opponent by throwing them onto the ground with a hard impact, or dislocating joints with a throw. Imagine "Street Judo".
In my humble opinion as far as combat goes, modern Judo seems to be more of a supplimental art to other combat arts such as BJJ, Muay Thai, Boxing, Sambo, Kali, etc. I think there is a lot of useful info there, but again most of it is sport oriented unless you are training in other arts that can help you incorporate those concepts. (See Bruce Lee's book Tao of Jeet Kune Do)
I definately think you should try it out if its free and your looking for something fun to do. You many not learn as much about actual combat, but it is a great physical activity and it will teach you the core basics of grappling, falling, throwing, etc. if you end up moving into other arts. You'll probably also meet some great people who mix it up with other martial arts that will be able to show you a few things for the street. And dont get me wrong, about 12 years ago I spent some time with a guy named Christophe Leninger who was on the US olympic team for Judo and he could definately kick ass when called upon.
Best of luck my friend!
Dear Oblivion,
Heres a few cool insights to Judo that may interest you.
Judo, although now primarily a sport, was once primarily a defensive grappling art. Modern day Brazilian Jiu Jitsu (BJJ) which has gained world wide recognition from fighters in Mixed Martial Arts competions (like the Ultimate Fighting Championship) was actually derived from Judo. Im sure you've heard of the Gracie's who popularized BJJ, use text book grappling moves from Judo and adapted them to a more street style of fighting in the earlier part of the century. Mitsuyo Maeda, a student of the founder of Judo (Jigaro Kano) brought it to Brazil teaching it to Gaesto Gracie, and the Gracie's refined it as more of a "Ground" style rather than the "throwing" sport that Judo has become. If you ever come across an old school Judo book you will find all the same finishing moves that you see in modern MMA combat (Armbar, chokes, Kimura lock, figure 4, kato gari), but thats up to your Judo instructor if he teaches those or not, and of course how much you train to use it.
Another interesting thing, there is a Chinese art similar to Judo called shuai chao which focussus on throwing techniques such as the ones found in Judo. Shuai chao is designed to disable your opponent by throwing them onto the ground with a hard impact, or dislocating joints with a throw. Imagine "Street Judo".
In my humble opinion as far as combat goes, modern Judo seems to be more of a supplimental art to other combat arts such as BJJ, Muay Thai, Boxing, Sambo, Kali, etc. I think there is a lot of useful info there, but again most of it is sport oriented unless you are training in other arts that can help you incorporate those concepts. (See Bruce Lee's book Tao of Jeet Kune Do)
I definately think you should try it out if its free and your looking for something fun to do. You many not learn as much about actual combat, but it is a great physical activity and it will teach you the core basics of grappling, falling, throwing, etc. if you end up moving into other arts. You'll probably also meet some great people who mix it up with other martial arts that will be able to show you a few things for the street. And dont get me wrong, about 12 years ago I spent some time with a guy named Christophe Leninger who was on the US olympic team for Judo and he could definately kick ass when called upon.
Best of luck my friend!
Im going to start next week! Thanks guys
I got somethin comin' for Malk with my new upcomin' avatar.
Thats actually a great question. Japanese Jiu Jitsu was around much longer than Judo, and the founder of Judo (Jigaro Kano) was a student of Japanese Jiu Jitsu. Judo's only been around for about 130 years, relatively new if you compare it to some styles. There is not much consistancy between Japanese Jiu Jitsu and BJJ or Judo, but youll see that JJJ is very similar to Aikido.
Helio and his older brother Carlos both learned it from thier father Gaesto's friend Maeda. Both of them branded it as thier own, and Helios sons (Royce, Royler, Rorion, Reylson, Rokler) were the ones who popularized it in the US, beginning with Rorion becoming the martial arts consultant for Leathal Weapon 1 (you'll notice Mel Gibson finishing off Gary Busy in a trademark BJJ "Triangle" choke), then Rorion was one of the founding partners in the first UFC in Denver 1993, where his brother Royce won.
Maeda, who brought it to Brazil may have called it Jiu Jitsu but it was more or less Jigaro Kano's ground Judo. Japanese Jiu Jitsu is much more like Aiki Jitsu or what Morehei Ueshiba later developed as "Ai-Ki-Do". Japanese Jiu Jitsu consists of mostly joint locks because it was designed to disarm and defeat armored noblemen. Joint locks work with armor where strikes may not be as effective. Later, Morehei Ueshiba took many of these techniques and added some of his own and created his own style of Aikido after the Japanese Russo war.
I guess the point I was trying to initially make is to give credit to some of Judo's unseen history. I am a little dissapointed in how Rorion exploited BJJ in the USA in the 90's. Although he did a lot for modern martial arts, I think he was extremely monitarily motivated. I was lucky to have the opportunity to train with a lot of the Gracie brothers, couisins, etc, but I wasnt too impressed with how Rorion ran his clubs and with held information from his own paying students. Im glad to see those techniques as part of so many other martial arts programs though and glad the Rorion Gracie franchise cant be controlled anymore.
Im glad to see the openmindedness of people on this board, and the willingness for people to try out all different kinds of arts.
You actually touched on something really interesting here. well interesting to me.
If you got some dude with armor swinging a sword around (not just talking Samurai, many Japanese would have worn swords and armor in feudal Japan) there are 3 ways to deal with it.
They developed 3 ways to fight guys with armor...
1, Shotokan style Karate. The Armor worn in Feudal Japan was not solid, but made of small metal strips bound with leather, so if you hit the breast plate hard enough it would still buckle. Also the samurai face mask (mempo) was not invented until the 16th Century, which is why the face is much more of a target in Shotokan Karate compared to Wado Ryu Karate.
Shotokan is considered to be quite slow, because of the very long stances and huge punches, but it’s the perfect unarmed fighting style to fight an armored opponent because the armored opponent would move even slower.
2, Aikido, the metal plates in the armor would have only helped with the grappling, wrist and arm locks. Once you have disarmed a samurai and have him in a lock, he is nothing but a lump of armor.
3, Jiu juitsu, Food for thought... It’s hard enough to get up of the ground when you have been thrown over your opponents head and he is now sitting on you with your arms behind your back. Image what it’s like when you are wearing 30lbs of restricting armor... Your pretty much screwed.
Great thread we got going on here
On that note of unarmed vs armed combat, theoretically speaking, Bil-Ji techniques from Wing Chun (although not a Japanese art) might be a formidable addition to your list. Am I correct to assume that by Jiu Jitsu you mean BJJ as you mentioned ground fighting? And Aikido in reference to Japanese Jiu Jitusu (as Aikido was developed in the earlier 20th century, an even newer art than Judo, but using many Japanese Jiu Jitsu joint locks)?
Thats cool of you to bring up Wado and Shotokan. I never trained Shotokan, Goju or Kyokoshin but did quite a bit of Wado in my youth and college years. I used to take a great interest in the teachings of the Innovators of Japanese arts like Kano, Ueshiba or if your speaking Karate, Mas Oyama
Ruthless JUDO
Gday , everyone I teach self. defence here in australia to small but very dedicated few, OUR GROUP is known as " SAIBOU" wich is japanese
for! THE CELL! We mainly get into military (sdf) Have a few friends in
Canada teaching SYSTEMA (russian spec forces,h 2 h.) Run by a great guy
Vladamier Vasiliev His stuff ,WAS EVEN a secret in the russian,SPETNATs
units. Check him out. Anyway , back to bussiness. To my limited knowledge
judo has originally had an element of SELF DEFENCE in it. But when they took
it to the masses, they watered it down & turned it into a sport. I have a
copy of a book called (The method of self defence by M KAWAISHI 7th dan
it was taught to police & the military, MATE it's ferrel ,EYE gouges ,head butts,hammerfists, bites,elbows, knees gun disarming, knife & batton work. WE at !the cell refer to it as THE ORIGINAL SDF BOOK. can anyone date it?
When you see this there's no doudbt that judo HAD a lot more then we
realise. hope that helped cobba.
Gday , everyone I teach self. defence here in australia to small but very dedicated few, OUR GROUP is known as " SAIBOU" wich is japanese
for! THE CELL! We mainly get into military (sdf) Have a few friends in
Canada teaching SYSTEMA (russian spec forces,h 2 h.) Run by a great guy
Vladamier Vasiliev His stuff ,WAS EVEN a secret in the russian,SPETNATs
units. Check him out. Anyway , back to bussiness. To my limited knowledge
judo has originally had an element of SELF DEFENCE in it. But when they took
it to the masses, they watered it down & turned it into a sport. I have a
copy of a book called (The method of self defence by M KAWAISHI 7th dan
it was taught to police & the military, MATE it's ferrel ,EYE gouges ,head butts,hammerfists, bites,elbows, knees gun disarming, knife & batton work. WE at !the cell refer to it as THE ORIGINAL SDF BOOK. can anyone date it?
When you see this there's no doudbt that judo HAD a lot more then we
realise. hope that helped cobba.
Mate work out what you want , if your not sure judo 's for you then ring them up. Tell them what your after, why you want to do it. Be it eg. SPORT or SELF DEFENCE ,whatever. Mate if the guys fairdinkum (straight up)
He'll tell you what he's about, if he can help, or if he can't. Most instructor's
may peddle thier own art, but if you tell them exactly what you want, they'll help you or be honest enough to put you onto someone,or a style that'll suit ya. Write a list of what you want from the style. (your needs & ALSO what you don't want.) now you can walk in ask ?s & get honest answers. The people on this site, are a good source & will try to give you some direction
Goodluck COBBA
He'll tell you what he's about, if he can help, or if he can't. Most instructor's
may peddle thier own art, but if you tell them exactly what you want, they'll help you or be honest enough to put you onto someone,or a style that'll suit ya. Write a list of what you want from the style. (your needs & ALSO what you don't want.) now you can walk in ask ?s & get honest answers. The people on this site, are a good source & will try to give you some direction
Goodluck COBBA