It Starts...

[Curvie Girlie]

Val I actually was having a thin and beautiful day. I wore my glasses yesterday and kinda felt like a sexy librarian... ha ha ha and my pants were super loose so that helped too!!

YAY!

I think on all aspects of genetics I am attempting to go against the grain. I come from a family of overweight and seriously obese people.

I just want to find that body that I am comfortable in and confident in. Right now I'm at a cross roads....I am excited to be happy with my body or part of it... but then frustrated that I still have a long way to go before I am satisfied.

Ahhhh Dee you are so beautiful! However, if I step back and look at it objectively, I understand how you want a more-matching upper and lower body. It looks like it drives you NUTS! However, if what you're saying about your family is true, BIG UPS to you for battling genetics and winning!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously!!!!

I had to re-read Steve's post carefully because I was going to disagree with him. I have been in a lot of races, and got to see runners' different bodies. There are LOTS of lean women runners out there--still, most of them LOOK like they have genetics on their side, but who can say? The other day my boyfriend actually told me "You look naturally skinny." I was like this: because you seen my chubby pictures, right? I was like that most of my post-adolescence. Everything is relative and yes we are probably going to have skewed self-images sometimes. I think even Steve said "I'm much smaller and uglier in real life" Anyway, we are both proof that people can work hard against their tendencies toward obesity (my mom is small and petite with a little appetite; my dad was obese with a BEAR SIZED appetite and I lean toward his behavior with food, but my mom's tendency toward exercise every day) so YAY!

 

[LovelyLadyHumps]

I'm not an expert on leanness or fitness in general...all I can do is share with you my personal experiences. My family genetics tend to show that we have proportional upper and lower halves. When I gain weight it goes everywhere evenly w/out discrimination. My face, arms, belly, ass, upper back, boobs, calves, and thighs all grow in sync. LOL

So...I can tell you what running has done for me.

Pros:
Before running I had no definition in my calves and you could see a little cut in my quads but not much. I pretty much had "soft looking legs". No definition. After running for over a year and shedding 20lbs, I know have the "horse shoe" calves and my upper thighs have so much definition. My ass is perkier and my cellulite is nearly gone. I can tell that I have built muscle from all the running but it is by no means "bulky"...my muscles are becoming leaner and sexier. My legs have never looked better and I can contribute it all to my running....

Cons:
During the peak of my training I did not loose much weight. In order to run the longer distances (and because I ran at a slower pace) I needed more fuel to keep my bootie going. I also found myself hungry a lot from all the running so I ate more. I didn't gain weight and infact I think I lost about 9lbs over 4 months but what I did notice is that my body transformed. My pants got looser and my muscles became stronger and more defined.

I've pretty much neglected weight training over the past few years and my upper arms are flabby. I've never really had this problem until about 2 years ago. I know I really need to do the weights....I know!! I'm working on it.

This is totally random but somewhat relevant. Have you noticed Beyonce's legs lately? I saw her on SNL a few weeks back and her thighs were half the size they used to be. She has always had larger upper thighs and recently they were super tiny. I always assumed that she just had a lot of muscle. I wonder what she did to reduce the bulk in her legs?

 

[Curvie Girlie]

my upper thighs have so much definition. My ass is perkier and my cellulite is nearly gone. I can tell that I have built muscle from all the running but it is by no means "bulky"...my muscles are becoming leaner and sexier. My legs have never looked better and I can contribute it all to my running....

Same here.

During the peak of my training I did not loose much weight. In order to run the longer distances (and because I ran at a slower pace) I needed more fuel to keep my bootie going. I also found myself hungry a lot from all the running so I ate more.

Same here.

I've pretty much neglected weight training over the past few years and my upper arms are flabby. I've never really had this problem until about 2 years ago. I know I really need to do the weights....I know!! I'm working on it.

That, and also you could join my Yoga studio--my arms have never been leaner, and my love handles have melted away it seems.

This is totally random but somewhat relevant. Have you noticed Beyonce's legs lately? I saw her on SNL a few weeks back and her thighs were half the size they used to be. She has always had larger upper thighs and recently they were super tiny. I always assumed that she just had a lot of muscle. I wonder what she did to reduce the bulk in her legs?

Rhianna has bigger legs and a very small upper body, too:

 

[MissDFITT]

Ahhhh Dee you are so beautiful! However, if I step back and look at it objectively, I understand how you want a more-matching upper and lower body. It looks like it drives you NUTS! However, if what you're saying about your family is true, BIG UPS to you for battling genetics and winning!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously!!!!

I had to re-read Steve's post carefully because I was going to disagree with him. I have been in a lot of races, and got to see runners' different bodies. There are LOTS of lean women runners out there--still, most of them LOOK like they have genetics on their side, but who can say? The other day my boyfriend actually told me "You look naturally skinny." I was like this: because you seen my chubby pictures, right? I was like that most of my post-adolescence. Everything is relative and yes we are probably going to have skewed self-images sometimes. I think even Steve said "I'm much smaller and uglier in real life" Anyway, we are both proof that people can work hard against their tendencies toward obesity (my mom is small and petite with a little appetite; my dad was obese with a BEAR SIZED appetite and I lean toward his behavior with food, but my mom's tendency toward exercise every day) so YAY!

Aw thanks Val. I know that I do have a skewed view of myself but I the proof is in the numbers... when you have a 24" waist and 40" hips.. something is not quite right ya know?

I think I've found that although there are some genetics you can't fight... like having fair skin lets say... but you can sure as hell battle obesity no matter what the genetics.. ya you may not be super model thin (and honestly who wants to be???) but you can still be at a normal weight!! It bothers me that some use genetics as an excuse when it comes to being overweight!!

I agree that many of the runner's I've seen are in good all over shape with good muscle tone... but not all. Stephen is pretty much up in arms about the whole thing he disagrees completely... but he is a runner who is genetically skinny.... Either way it comes down to me having to make the decision "TO RUN OR NOT TO RUN...." but again I will wait for more advice from Steve until I can really make up my mind. For the time being I am just going to concentrate on sticking to the 12 week program I worked out... which includes WAY more strength training than I've been doing.


So we will see. Stephen thinks I am just being impatient. I think since I joined this forum in June I've lost 12 pounds... and I felt like it just melted off the time went soooo quickly and now I want to loose another 12-15 pounds and like NOW.... so in all actuality maybe I am just not being frank with myself. And now that I've only lost 1.1 pounds since the beginning of this challenge I'm starting to look at where the problem lies... and when possibly it lies within and expecting BIG losses right away... ya know???

 

[MissDFITT]

I'm not an expert on leanness or fitness in general...all I can do is share with you my personal experiences. My family genetics tend to show that we have proportional upper and lower halves. When I gain weight it goes everywhere evenly w/out discrimination. My face, arms, belly, ass, upper back, boobs, calves, and thighs all grow in sync. LOL

So...I can tell you what running has done for me.

Pros:
Before running I had no definition in my calves and you could see a little cut in my quads but not much. I pretty much had "soft looking legs". No definition. After running for over a year and shedding 20lbs, I know have the "horse shoe" calves and my upper thighs have so much definition. My ass is perkier and my cellulite is nearly gone. I can tell that I have built muscle from all the running but it is by no means "bulky"...my muscles are becoming leaner and sexier. My legs have never looked better and I can contribute it all to my running....

Cons:
During the peak of my training I did not loose much weight. In order to run the longer distances (and because I ran at a slower pace) I needed more fuel to keep my bootie going. I also found myself hungry a lot from all the running so I ate more. I didn't gain weight and infact I think I lost about 9lbs over 4 months but what I did notice is that my body transformed. My pants got looser and my muscles became stronger and more defined.

I've pretty much neglected weight training over the past few years and my upper arms are flabby. I've never really had this problem until about 2 years ago. I know I really need to do the weights....I know!! I'm working on it.

This is totally random but somewhat relevant. Have you noticed Beyonce's legs lately? I saw her on SNL a few weeks back and her thighs were half the size they used to be. She has always had larger upper thighs and recently they were super tiny. I always assumed that she just had a lot of muscle. I wonder what she did to reduce the bulk in her legs?

Thanks for posting this... and 9 pounds in 4 months is pretty impressive if you ask me. But we are sooo differently shaped... I would assume that since I have little fat left up top that it would come off the bottom... but maybe I would continue to just get smaller on the top... who knows?? That's why I'm hoping for balance....


Funny you mention Beyonce... I think if I was to idolize someone's body or want to have someone's body it would be hers because she is very similar to my shape... But I have NOT seen her lately and I will for sure have to check it out. I've read about her workouts in many different magazines and from what I understood she always wanted to keep her ghetto bottom.... hmmm maybe that was JLo... either way I think she has a rockn' body and she is GORGEOUS!!!

 

[Curvie Girlie]

when you have a 24" waist and 40" hips.. something is not quite right ya know?

Nah it means you can be in a rap video--and that's a good thing! Hell, I'd do it!

It bothers me that some use genetics as an excuse when it comes to being overweight!!

Yes, I blamed my genetics on my tendency to put on weight but what it really was, was my tendency to drink, , and overeat! I mean, STUFF myself! Man, that seemed fun but looking back, that heavy feeling of being stuffed from huge meals sucks.

For the time being I am just going to concentrate on sticking to the 12 week program I worked out... which includes WAY more strength training than I've been doing.

In my opinion, I think if you started a lifting plan and went as heavy as possible and suffered through the pain and soreness, I think a lot of bunny chub would go away and definition would show up.

now that I've only lost 1.1 pounds since the beginning of this challenge I'm starting to look at where the problem lies... and when possibly it lies within and expecting BIG losses right away... ya know???

Steve said weight loss is stress on the body. Maybe you need to allow a plateau for a while before you try losing again? Or maybe it's too much cardio and not enough heavy lifting?

 

[Steve]

This is totally random but somewhat relevant. Have you noticed Beyonce's legs lately? I saw her on SNL a few weeks back and her thighs were half the size they used to be. She has always had larger upper thighs and recently they were super tiny. I always assumed that she just had a lot of muscle. I wonder what she did to reduce the bulk in her legs?

Probably started running.

Few random comments from your post and I think Val's.

1. You have to consider how many people choose a particular sport/activity b/c that is what they are most genetically inclined to do. Most marathoners are built for long distance running. Their muscles are more favorably 'built' for endurance. Their bodies don't store fat as easily as others.

I'm not suggesting someone coming from a heavy set background can't excel in marathoning. I'm suggesting in most any sport, the majority of athletes in said sport are going to be genetically inclined.

That's why you don't see many sprinters who are also endurance runners and vice versa. The preponderance of genetics they have favor a specific type of activity.

I bring this up for the simple reason of saying if you consider most marathoners as lean or having the ideal build, I do believe genetics are a huge factor in this observation.

2. We know that endurance running is not conducive for muscle maintenance. That's a fact. We also know to be lean, we need a combination of fat loss and muscle gain.

3. We have to be careful what we're saying here; we're getting close to talking about spot reduction. Running. It is a form of resistance training. Very light resistance training, relatively speaking, but it is resistance training. That said, for someone who hasn't been resistance training, it most likely can and will lead some favorable muscle adaptations. Definitely increased endurance (oxidative) qualities. But quite possibly some hypertrophy of leg musculature since they aren't used to the 'resistance training' component of running. Hypertrophy while losing fat goes a long, long way (even in small amounts) to helping lean out particular body parts, i.e, legs.

So running possibly could lead to some favorable body composition changes like in Melissa's case. She was dieting and running. Started running a lot within the last year. So what do we have? A caloric deficit so fat is going to be lost. We also have overloading resistance on her leg muscles which can and most likely did lead to some hypertrophy. These things in combination are what I would bet my house on led to the changes she highlighted.

But running in itself isn't magic for leg fat. In fact, if I were going to train specifically for leanness, running would be low on the totem pole.

4. Melissa's leg fat most likely isn't as stubborn as Dee's. She has a more balanced fat distribution. Dee allots the majority of her fat in her lower half. If it were my client (being Dee), I most certainly would be implementing something like Lyle's Stubborn Body Fat Solution and replace a lot of the marathon running. Comparing Mel and Dee is comparing apples to oranges.

5. You don't get to pick and choose what sort of muscle changes you see. This is in response to something Melissa said about her muscle changes being lean and not bulky. It might appear that way. However, a muscle either grows or it doesn't. Different attributes of the muscle can 'grow' (see sarcoplasmic vs. myofibrillar hypertrophy) but the fact remains, the muscle will grow or not. It doesn't grow lean vs. grow bulky. In women, especially who are dieting and running shit tons, getting bulky is fucking impossible. That said, looking back over #3, it's easy to see that Melissa experienced nice fat loss in her legs while possibly growing her legs muscles a bit giving them the leaner appearance.

I think I had like 3 more points to make when I was reading through everything but I forget them because my brain is small and retarded.

 

[LovelyLadyHumps]

I think I had like 3 more points to make when I was reading through everything but I forget them because my brain is small and retarded.

You brought a smile to my face and made my eyes water with this last bit. haha!! I love you Steve! You Rock.

 

[Steve]

Aw thanks Val. I know that I do have a skewed view of myself but I the proof is in the numbers... when you have a 24" waist and 40" hips.. something is not quite right ya know?

The extreme contrast can mostly be pointed to your genetics.

Sure, if you didn't eat over your needs in the past, the contrasted measurements may not be as extreme b/c your lower body wouldn't have been storing body fat to the extent it did.

That said, you'd still have the classic tiny waist and curvy thighs which should, and probably does sound appealing to you.

I think I've found that although there are some genetics you can't fight... like having fair skin lets say... but you can sure as hell battle obesity no matter what the genetics.. ya you may not be super model thin (and honestly who wants to be???) but you can still be at a normal weight!! It bothers me that some use genetics as an excuse when it comes to being overweight!!

Very, very few can actually blame genetics.

Another point I wanted to make Dee is you're saying your upper body is really lean. Eventually your body is going to start tapping into your lower body fat stores.

It's not like your upper body is going to be the only thing to ever respond. It would disappear eventually and you'd be left with a set of legs and an ass.

I agree that many of the runner's I've seen are in good all over shape with good muscle tone... but not all. Stephen is pretty much up in arms about the whole thing he disagrees completely... but he is a runner who is genetically skinny.... Either way it comes down to me having to make the decision "TO RUN OR NOT TO RUN...."

No.

That's what I was talking about.

You women and your on/off, either/or perceptions.

It's not about that at all.

It's about leaning your training and nutrition to cater more towards being good at running marathons or it's about swaying it more toward the middle between being able to do a marathon and optimizing fat loss/muscle gain.

Neither option entails giving up running.

but again I will wait for more advice from Steve until I can really make up my mind. For the time being I am just going to concentrate on sticking to the 12 week program I worked out... which includes WAY more strength training than I've been doing.

Excellent.

So we will see. Stephen thinks I am just being impatient. I think since I joined this forum in June I've lost 12 pounds... and I felt like it just melted off the time went soooo quickly and now I want to loose another 12-15 pounds and like NOW.... so in all actuality maybe I am just not being frank with myself. And now that I've only lost 1.1 pounds since the beginning of this challenge I'm starting to look at where the problem lies... and when possibly it lies within and expecting BIG losses right away... ya know???

I forget if I said it in here in one of my recent big posts or what, but relatively lean women (which is you) can expect to lose 1-2 lbs per month. Some will be able to lose more comfortably. Many though will not.

Manage your expectations or you're always going to frustrated.

Shit, you could be losing 1-2 lbs per month of fat, and you'd never know b/c water/fluid retention would mask it entirely. Your body is doing what it's supposed to do in this case but you're allowing the scale to entirely dictate your emotional state, all for nothing. And it may not be the case with you, but this is why many trainers don't like working with leaner women.... they call them head cases. They'll fall on and off the wagon simply b/c the scale isn't doing what their preconceived notions are telling them it should be doing.

 

[Steve]

You brought a smile to my face and made my eyes water with this last bit. haha!! I love you Steve! You Rock.

I love you guys too.

 

[Curvie Girlie]

I love you guys too.

What a pussy


HAHAHA!

 

[Steve]

I'll fuck you up.

 

[Curvie Girlie]

I'll fuck you up.

Oh man I wish! NOT!

 

[MissDFITT]

January 24

So... I just want balance. I do want to be able to increase my running mileage but I also want to lean out as much as my body will allow. I am more than willing to compromise and honestly patience is what I am lacking most.

I've discussed these ideas with several of my close friends and family and they all think I am crazy for wanting to lose more and most think I am boarder line too thin. I WISH I could see what they are seeing... I think they are the crazy ones.

Today I went to a baby shower for my sister in law. It was the first ever baby shower I had ever been to... and yeah it was a little on the borning side for me. I do love my sissy and am wicked excited to be having a nephew... but her and I are not of the same breed.... we wouldnt necessarily be friends if she hadn't married my brother... get what I mean? And many of the girls that were there are much like her. You might notice I said girls because they all are or at least act that way. Not very grown up... still shop in the juniors section and look very young yet I was the youngest one there and my mom mentioned that I was also the classiest in the way that I carry myself and dress and what not. I'm just not on the same page as them, different priorities I guess. *shrugs*

After the shower my mom and I came back here and got her weekly workout in. We walked 2 miles at a fairly quick pace 3.0+ mph. Its pretty hilly so I really had her push on the steeper parts. She said she felt good and after our workout last Sunday was super motivated which makes me happy. She is coming over tomorrow AM for her weigh in and so I can go over her food/exercise logs. We did a preliminary weigh in and she was down about 3 pounds so I think this week has been a success for her.

I think I was able to convince my mom that I still had weight to lose. We changed together and I let her see me in my bra and panties... and she did say that women would kill for my body, but that she does see where those last few pounds lie... granted I had to "giggle" my legs at her.. I know sounds funny but I got my point across.

As for me... didn't have the best evening. Today was my long run day and I told myself I would get on the mill at 6:00 which would gave me about 20 mins to relax and what not after mom left. Well I fell asleep and Step came in and attempted to wake me... no dice. Then he proceeded to come in about every 10 mins... again I didn't get up... I was both freezing and starving and just wanted to stay curled up in the chair... so finally 7:00 rolls around and I get up... still hungry and cold... I grabbed come crackers and a hoodie and then decided to get on the mill.... ya again no dice. 4.0 mph seemed fast (WTF) and I just couldnt find a rythem... so I figred maybe I should put a sports bra on... Step brought me one and a hair tie. Tried again at 4.0 yep still fast... our stero works intermitnetly and it didn't come on for me so that wasn't helping... finally I got frustrated enough I just ran out the door (slammed it) and went and sat on the curb debating life..... eventually Step and Boomer came and got me. I'm just wicked moody and frustrated.... Its Satruday night and as usual I am at home with no plans. Step is content and sometimes I want a little excitement ya know?? Anyway we made dinner and that leaves me here now.... its just after 9 and I will most likely be in bed before 10. Sad right?

Ehhhh, I have alot on my mind. I haven't really been tracking cals since Wednesday, but I eat like a bird so I honestly don't think its a problem. When I cook Step usually eats about 3/4 of the food and I eat about 1/2 of my 1/4.... and he usually finishes it. We went to lunch yesterday and had new mexican dishes... I ate about 1/4 of my plate and then we switched (that's how we roll) and then about 1/8 of his plate and was done... of course both plates were cleared... ugh men and their high metabolisms!!! But I think my tummy is just tiny aswell. Even tonight I made scallops in a mushroom sauce... it was pretty damn tastey but I only ate a few bites... thats just how I roll I guess. I think at one time I had issues with food and they kinda still exist. Yes it tastes good but its not satisifying.... or I don't use it to satisfy me... ehhh I dunno....

I am just rambling if you can't tell.... my mind is a jumbled mess. Ah just like a woman....

 

[MissDFITT]

Its Monday and I was greeted with TOM this morning... not the best way to start a week let me tell ya.

I'm back to couting cals today, although I don't really have a goal in mind. Stay under 2000????? Eh, we will see. I am a little ravenous today but thats expected.

The weather yesterday was GORGEOUS so Step and I went out for a run. Did the Academy loop, 3.3 miles. We would have had a PR on this course, but I got a fierce cramp about .15 out and HAD to walk... I kept telling Step to run ahead but he wouldn't leave me behind... cute right?

We had a typical Sunday otherwise. Did our grocery shopping for the week and got things all planned out. My parents were in town and Mom wanted to do an official weigh in and while they were there we decided to get all registered for the walk/run on Valentine's day. Well the website was giving us trouble so Mom and Pop left and I looked up the place that is sponsering it... Athlete's Edge. Ha happens to be just down the block from our place... and we decided if they did an extensive running shoe fitting that we would get shoes while we were at it. Just so happens they did and we both got new shoes!! And the funny thing is the lady brought our 4 different pairs for me to try on and like 6 or 8 different pairs for Step to try on and we both went with Pumas... and NO it was not on purpose... they offered the most support and comfort. I'm excited to get into them tomorrow for my tempo run.

So yeah that's pretty much it. Tonight is strength, 70 mins or so. I really plan on pushing myself tonight and upping the weight a bit. Just gotta do it ya know? Also I haven't weighed myself since last Tuesday. I was getting a little obsessive so I put the scale away for a week. I don't expect big things tomorrow but I can hope. I cut out the Kashi I am convinced that's what was making my tummy unhappy... I think oatmeal is more filling anyway right??? Eh its all food....

Happy Monday to all!

 

[Curvie Girlie]

I do want to be able to increase my running mileage but I also want to lean out as much as my body will allow. I am more than willing to compromise and honestly patience is what I am lacking most.

Not very grown up... still shop in the juniors section and look very young yet I was the youngest one there and my mom mentioned that I was also the classiest in the way that I carry myself and dress and what not. I'm just not on the same page as them, different priorities I guess. *shrugs*

We did a preliminary weigh in and she was down about 3 pounds so I think this week has been a success for her.

finally I got frustrated enough I just ran out the door (slammed it) and went and sat on the curb debating life..... eventually Step and Boomer came and got me. I'm just wicked moody and frustrated.... Its Saturday night and as usual I am at home with no plans. Step is content and sometimes I want a little excitement ya know??

About the body: I REALLY think that you might have leaner legs with more weight training targeted at your lower body in addition to your running. I just think so--and I know it hurts, but the soreness can get kind of satisfying!

Heh--I'm 26 and shop in the juniors section--LOL! Sigh

Glad Mom is doing well on her program

Excitement--YES. I feel ya--but that would involve mingling with crazies. It's up to you!

 

[Curvie Girlie]

I'm back to couting cals today, although I don't really have a goal in mind. Stay under 2000????? Eh, we will see. I am a little ravenous today but thats expected.

The weather yesterday was GORGEOUS so Step and I went out for a run. Did the Academy loop, 3.3 miles. We would have had a PR on this course, but I got a fierce cramp about .15 out and HAD to walk... I kept telling Step to run ahead but he wouldn't leave me behind... cute right?

Weren't you eating 1500-1700 calories a day before?

That IS cute

have a great Monday, Beautiful!

 

[MissDFITT]

About the body: I REALLY think that you might have leaner legs with more weight training targeted at your lower body in addition to your running. I just think so--and I know it hurts, but the soreness can get kind of satisfying!

Heh--I'm 26 and shop in the juniors section--LOL! Sigh

Glad Mom is doing well on her program

Excitement--YES. I feel ya--but that would involve mingling with crazies. It's up to you!

That is currently the plan as far as the body goes. I PMed Steve today, we've been chatting a bit so hopefully he can give me some good guidelines. But the plan is to run 3x per week and Strength train 3x per week and go heavy.

Ha ha I shop in the Jrs too I won't lie, but I am cautious to not pick out things that would make me look like I'm 12.

LOL hey I'm a little crazy myself so I wouldnt mind it!!!!

 

[MissDFITT]

Weren't you eating 1500-1700 calories a day before?

That IS cute

have a great Monday, Beautiful!

Yeah I was but I figure a few more won't hurt. We will see what the damage is tomorrow morning and then move from there....

Ha I won't like I LOVE him.

 

[Curvie Girlie]

the plan is to run 3x per week and Strength train 3x per week and go heavy.

Sounds fabulous!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ha ha I shop in the Jrs too I won't lie, but I am cautious to not pick out things that would make me look like I'm 12.

Yes, that's key! I want cute clothes but not super-frilly-girly stuff

Hope all goes well! I think it will--weight stalls happen, when you change it up, the weight should come off.