Abs

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abercrombiedude

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A question for the boxers on abdominals. I use to do my abs a long time ago by the hundreds until I reach 500 a night. 2 years ago I changed all that. Instead of the traditional situp now I do variations. !00's of different variations weighted and without. I've noticed for conditioning boxers do 100s of incline and decline of the simple crunch. Does this mean that the muscles are stronger or weaker???
I haave a feeling that they are weaker. By doing the variations I do now I see more result than 2 years before. For conditioning I train with Bruce Lee's Martial Arts. But just to add to my fighting/training knowledge. ;)
 
What do you mean you train with Bruce Lee's martial art? Are you saying you study a variation of JKD or Wing Chung or?

You'll find a lot of boxers that train with really old, out dated methods. Some high reps are desirable for the endurance reasons but they should be spending more time on heavier weight/lower rep strengthening stuff. Once you've hit way past 20 reps, it's time to add weight.
 
abercrombiedude said:
. I've noticed for conditioning boxers do 100s of incline and decline of the simple crunch. Does this mean that the muscles are stronger or weaker???
;)
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Where have you noticed this?
You wouldn't see any pro boxers doing this, unless they are just showing off.
 
I do JKD.
Boxers do many many cunches it is a known fact, also I used to know friends who boxed. Even millitary men. I have a friend in the military I know now and he has to do 100s of crunches non stop. But if there is a way to get abdominals more quicker and effiecently with variations, why do 1000 crunches and over is all that I am saying? Would this prohibit someone to new levels of strength or help? I know that the apperence of abs is all in a low BF%(DIET) but for strength is in the training low reps high reisistance long rest periods. For me I do my abs high repetitions, quick low , almost no rest periods, enough resistance to complete my sets.
 
You'll find a lot of boxers that train with really old, out dated methods. Some high reps are desirable for the endurance reasons but they should be spending more time on heavier weight/lower rep strengthening stuff. Once you've hit way past 20 reps, it's time to add weight.
Reply With Quote

True True Endurence is VITAL
 
abercrombiedude said:
Boxers do many many cunches it is a known fact.
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Wow sorry man, didnt realize that it was a KNOWN FACT. it must be tue.

Well im sorry dude, but judging by your other posts its pretty obvious that you dont really no much, other than what you picked up on this forum.

I understand the benifits of doing high reps, and they are minimal. Anyone you know that does 100's of situps does it because they dont know how to train properly.

you know that you can just edit a post instead of writing 3.

you make it very unbelievable when you write
"For conditioning I train with Bruce Lee's Martial Arts."
if you really did, you would know its easyer to write JKD and wing chun.

what do you mean, you train with them? do you mean that you study them both? whats the point in doing both JKD and wing chun.
 
I'd say to alternate between the two methods-
high reps and lighter loads and low reps with heavier loads. I'll do times where I do a few heavier sets and then next training session I'll do a couple of drop sets.

I'd like to see more boxers adding sprints in with their road work.
 
Whatever manofkent I wasn't aware of the editing ok. Furthermore if I want to post something in my own way I can. You don't have to read it. And as for JKD, I do practice it. Bruce Lee is my mentor. I don't care what anyone thinks that they assume to know about me, let them feel the way they want.
Also I feel that the abdominals should not be ignored, they are an important part of training.
 
your very lucky to have Bruce as your mentor. Maybe when your done with him he could make another film.

Dude Im just saying... You have learned lots since you bin here, but you dont have much weight lifting knowledge out side of this forum.

When you say you practice JKD do you maen from a book or at a school. If so which school?
 
This is all I have to say about this post all I wanted to do was compare boxers' ab training to others. Personally I have a great interest in abdominals. I think they are very important. When it comes to Bruce Lee , he will never be dead to me or millions of others. I've followed his all of his books and whatever information I could recieve from my friends who do have personal JKD trainers. I am not rich so I take nothing for granted when it comes to learning about the legend.

Dude Im just saying... You have learned lots since you bin here, but you dont have much weight lifting knowledge out side of this forum.

Now as for my information on weightlifting. I don't do much posting because I am too busy most of my day. If I could share with you my whole knowledge on lifting you'd know that I am not just a beginner to say the least. I wish I could help everyone who needs help in their progression but I can't. And I knew prior to making a post about abs, someone was going to complain. I don't know why ? Anyway all I can say is this if this post bothers anyone don't reply?? Finally I'd like to add another reason besides I believe this forum is so great is because we have alot of good honest, smart, hard working, good looking people who have the potential and the know how to be just as
great if not better than any athelete, celebrity, cover model whatever in whatever.
Sharing our opinions on a workout method the more closer to those questions
answered that can help us reach our goals faster or add to our training knowledge.
I am not arguing here, I've got bigger problems to worry about. You guys helped me out before with quality input. And I appreciated it. So if this post bothers and you don't find it interesting, you move on to the next one.
 
LOL seriously...
Anyway, here's some good input and advice from me; and this is serious;

Get your head out of your ass. Pertaining to JKD, that is. It's a method, not a complete system of martial arts. It's basically kickboxing, if that...because you don't learn combos. I am willing to bet your friends with "personal JKD trainers" are being cheated. Bruce Lee is dead, therefore, he cannot be your mentor. A mentor is alive. Instead, try idol. Walking around thinking Bruce Lee is your mentor is complete bull.

Also, you said, "I am not rich so I take nothing for granted when learning about The Legend." Really? Bob Marley is that important to you, eh? lol. You can find information about him and his legacy online or from other resources, as long as they are qualified. Most of them are free, by the way (library, online, downloading his interviews, documentaries, etc.). And what is qualification? You'll have to figure that out yourself, but it sounds to me that you're swallowing everything some douche tells you, hook line and sinker.

Just my two cents.
 
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LeiYunFat said:
It's a method, not a complete system of martial arts. It's basically kickboxing,
Click to expand...

Thats a very interesting way of looking at it. I trained with a couple of JKDers, one of whom was one of Mr Lee's 1st 40 students (this was only a seminar) and I can see what you mean.

Being Karate, I dont agree with a lot of JKD. I dont believe in the Formless art. He said that you dont need the repetitive motions of form, but you should flow instinctively. well... we do that aswell. I think that practice is perfect and Kata/forms are an important part, of the art and for health.

I believe that bruce was a particularly good fighter and a good show off, which makes me wonder if JKD is really the 1st "martial art" to be invented for westerners, not so much for the skill and realizm, but as a buisness.

JKD and his films has given his family a great life and he is a legend - Which is what he wanted. I believe that just like Suppliments that make promises, boxercise and many attention seeking money grabbers he just tried to appeel to americans with this wonderous art form. He was very clever and I think thats what he was trying to do.
 
I agree with it, in the sense that it takes someone "formless" to be a good fighter. If there is an open spot, hit. If there is an attack coming, move, block, parry, or counterattack.

What Lee was going against was the martial artists who thought their forms were supreme, and that they were the ultimate fight trainers. I don't believe that forms are perfect either. Rather, they are just another form of shadowboxing, with a lack of spontanaity. Forms teach you a lot. But if you want to know how to fight, then the only way is to fight.

Forms also wire you a certain way. When fighting, and if indeed "instinct" takes over, one would follow the neural path created after practicing forms for years. Like if someone was going to throw a punch. After all this training, you block outside, enter in, and sweep. But according to Lee, why? It's a waste of energy. If someone punches, parry and punch, or whatever. There's an interview of Lee demonstrating this idea when being grabbed. If someone grabs you, you do this and this, turn your wrist like this, put your foot out 45 degrees, etc. Why? At some point, to demonstrate JKD, Lee just stomps. The hand retracts.
 
Yeah man.
For me Kata/Forms when performed hard and fast puts me in the same medatitive state as tai chi which I also do.
when you flying round the room performing kata, you are aware and unaware of what you are doing. You know whats your doing, but you dont have to think about it, This is the same feeling as when you are actually in the situation where you have to use it.
There is much more awareness involved in "free" boxing, which is not always a good thing. you need to have no feeling, and no mind when in kata, boxing and fighting, I find when sparing, padwork or free boxing I have too much mind on offence and defence.

I feel by doing kata/forms you'll actually gain what Bruce Lee ment, to be a free fighter.

However, he did train Forms for years and perhaps he already had the benifits of them but didnt realize it was the forms that helped him. Just a theory.
 
I agree with that, cept I like doing my forms better than tai chi...I know one tai chi form, I hate it. But I would go so far as to say anything repeated many times becomes medatative. Yes, a fighter should have no mind, which is why, a few years ago, kickboxers were dominating martial arts competitions. People learned the basics, got good at them, and decimated. Which is also why boxers dominate their type of fighters. They only have to learn four or five moves.

Like I said before, forms are basically like shadowboxing. The thing is that forms, once you learn them, lack spontaneity. And when these forms are practiced many times, over and over, it becomes detrimental to a formless mind. Even fighting with no mind, the mind is stuck in it's own trail. That's the idea, anyway. I don't think there are any ultimates. The key is to know what and why you do the things you do in the form. That way, the movements become can become seperate from the form and used whenever. However, one can argue, that with a large repertiore of moves, the mind can become bogged down with what to do. But I believe, this can usually be overcome with the right training.
 
very true about kickboxers, they have fantastic motivation. Many martial arts are far more complicated than they need to be. But thats what makes them fasinating.

I love kata and I belive it has helped me mentally and physically in my martial arts. I think that your comment about repitition becoming detrimental is true, but only for those of limited knowledge of kata and limited potential in martial arts. For those that enjoy kata it becomes an exercise that helps you daily, its an escape, its exercise, its imagening. I'd rather do 1 of 18 katas some of which are 200 steps, than kick and punch a tree 8hours a day. But like you drop a pot of coins on the floor, they never fall the same way twice. A kata is never the same twice, But it takes a lot of knowledge and experiance to see and feel this.

But dont get me wrong, if we are talking about actually confrontation then boxing and sparing will be the most help.
 
Above all else, I think forms are the best for you to learn how your body works and how power is generated. And, according to the Dhamamapada (Buddhist text), "A man cannot hope to conquer others until he has conquered himself." Outta context, but it can be applied in the same way.

It's true that you can learn something everytime by doing a form, but this only goes so far and is limited to how you interpret the lesson.

I thought we were talking about combat the whole time, lol. Or atleast had a combat undertone.

The sense that forms bring you to center is on the mark. But so is anything else. We can see this when we take the words, gong fu and translate them to work, or work ethic, or effort.

A man can have good lawn mowing gong, or rock clmibing gong. Similarly, if gong fu has benefits of meditation, then these things also have it.

****, I just noticed how repetive my words sound, and that I've been mispelling "Meditate"...well it's like 2 AM right now and I got school tomorrow...

night
 
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