So if you have shoulder problems, you could ditch overhead pressing. Ive actually been thinking about doing this before, since my shoulder has been bothering me in the past. Im wondering, is incline bench pressing as risky as overhead pressing? If i do ditch overhead pressing, id like to still have some way to develop my shoulders.
Bad shoulder posture.
- Thread starter timothyparuku
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No surprise here, but I'm in complete agreement with Bill: I honestly can't remember the last time that I gave a "pure" overhead press to a client...not only is there a great deal of "risk" involved for an already damaged shoulder, there's just no way to be able to safely evaluate an individual's shoulder/acromion in an eval to know their individual injury risk, IMO...especially when there are other exercises that can be used in replacement.
Karky, incline presses are safer, as would closed chain pushups...realize that any pushup or bench press will work the shoulders, so don't worry about not having an OH press in the routine, especially given the fact that you've had pain in the past.
Karky, incline presses are safer, as would closed chain pushups...realize that any pushup or bench press will work the shoulders, so don't worry about not having an OH press in the routine, especially given the fact that you've had pain in the past.
So, Your saying the majority of the population need not do a Vertical press?
Thanks alot for the help bip and leigh!
if i ditch military press. i still got alot of pressing going on, i bench press once a week and pushup twice a week (one loaded and one BW). So my shoulders are covered. I was wondering, when you remove MP and still do pullups, can that lead to an imbalance?
if i ditch military press. i still got alot of pressing going on, i bench press once a week and pushup twice a week (one loaded and one BW). So my shoulders are covered. I was wondering, when you remove MP and still do pullups, can that lead to an imbalance?
It's pretty arrogant to tell another member to completely ignore advice from other members and point them in the direction of an internet article. Not to mention that the advice given by Adler and Matt was very good and relevant to the original poster.
I disagree with this. Yes you will get some anterior and medial deltoid work as well but not doing any sort of overhead press is a bit silly. Isolation of the anterior and medial deltoid is not absolutely necessary either but as long as you do enough back (chest:back, 1:2) then it will not harm you. From what you're saying, it isn't necessary to do any tricep or bicep work either since tris will be worked in chest exercises and bis will be worked in back exercises. That's all fine for someone that's new to the gym, but for a more experienced lifter?
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Need? No...
But don't get me wrong, a standing OH press is an excellent exercise from a purely muscle/strength development standpoint...but as Bill had pointed out in the article/interview, it's really not appropriate for the overwhelming majority of individuals. Think about this: our society has become increasingly associated with a forward-posture/position. We sit at desks all day, type on computers, exercise less, all leading to weak backs and forward positioning for our shoulders. The last thing that you want to do is take that same 9-5:30 office worker and give him/her more specialized work to develop the muscles of the front of the shoulder and increase the tendency for that individual's shoulder to draw forwards...that's just an impingment waiting to happen! It's the same sort of category to me as an upright row: compound movement and excellent exercise, but not worth the risks to the shoulder in using it.
Honestly, I can't think of a scenario that you could have an imbalance the other way (posterior positioning) for the shoulder. You'd probably have soft tissue restrictions (and possibly even bony blocks, too) before that happened...
Thank you for clearning that up for me! I'll have to tell Bill (as well as the rest of my professors, actually) that he was wrong!...well, since I have an obvious expert at shoulder health and pre-hab, I should ask you to help me out then with some of my clients' workouts. Maybe you could help to design a workout for me with the goal to prevent subacromial supraspinatus impingement along with fat loss for a 34 year-old office worker who presents with thoracic and cervical kyphosis and an anterior shoulder positioning with an unknown acromion type who sits at a computer for 50-60 hours/week. Could you help me out so that I don't appear to be silly when I don't recommend OH pressing to this individual...or should I say individuals, since this is the exact posture that I see in at least 90% of my initial clients and in the gym or even when I look at people in the streets.
BTW, it's middle deltoids, not "medial." Oh, and the middle deltoids will become quite activated with pull-ups and row motions too, not just OH presses. Problem solved.
Depends on the individual and the goals/needs. Then again, since that's a completely different example that has a completely different set of factors that have nothing to do with the anatomy and risk stratification that we were discussing earlier, it's also really not a relevant example.
Wow, really interesting view on it, Thanks Bip!
Say you have someone who has entered a situation such as you described above. How does one go about correcting that? Curious is all, thanks again.
theleip
2
I find it funny that the people so quick to call me arrogant or point out my rude disregards are the people who's general attitude towards others is disrespectful. Pot I would like to introduce you to kettle.
Regardless of that the OP needed more guidance and explanation. A fantastic article by top experts in their field with pictures, video and more gave him that. There is nothing wrong with pointing out an article that gives great explanation and saves time.
I actually felt when I put out 'ignore that, go here' that is was more in the manner of 'hey, don't worry about trying to understand that, just check out this and your all good'. I am generally a pretty nice poster around here, I really think the tone was mistook in the first place as I felt no internal hostility.
I could understand you/whoever having a problem if the OP didn't get the correct answer to his questions due to my "arrogance", that however isn't what is upsetting. What is upsetting is it is seen as getting trumped, which is a ridiculous notion in the first place, and that is just ego.
Have any of the posters here torn a rotator cuff? oh good lord the recovery time and pain involved in that one. I am not commenting on the article, I didn't read it. My point- WE have a youngster here placing his shoulder at our mercy; let's get together. the exercise is either good or not.
To the 15 yeard old with the weighing neighbor comment- SWEET!
To the origional poster.
JUST stand up straight!! shoulders back, chin up a bit, point your crown to the sky and get on with it already!!
FF'er
To the 15 yeard old with the weighing neighbor comment- SWEET!
To the origional poster.
JUST stand up straight!! shoulders back, chin up a bit, point your crown to the sky and get on with it already!!
FF'er
Ok leip i see your view now lets move on...
The advice we gave was totally valid ask any phsyotherapist and they will tell you that, its not my fault he didnt understand, he just doesnt know the terminology.
In regards with the article, i cant really remember much now but i dont think it was quite specific and concise for the lad. Dont get me wrong though im sure it helped him understand significantly about his scapthorax "joint".
The advice we gave was totally valid ask any phsyotherapist and they will tell you that, its not my fault he didnt understand, he just doesnt know the terminology.
In regards with the article, i cant really remember much now but i dont think it was quite specific and concise for the lad. Dont get me wrong though im sure it helped him understand significantly about his scapthorax "joint".