The Conceptual Side of Weight Lifting

Very enlightening post, Steve. Just like when I lost weight, I felt much more comfortable when I knew the insides, logic and theories into HOW to do it and WHY; I had no specific program, just logic and critical thought. This post has helped me look at weight lifting in a similar light.

I'm going to my new gym for the first time in a couple of hours, and I plan to use free weights rather than weight machines and follow just the basic workout routine until further down the track. A little nervous, but I should be right.

Hopefully doing so will build me some muscle and get me out of this 'skinny-fat' limbo.

Cheers!
Shannon
 
Well good luck, Shannon. If you need anything, simply ask. I'm glad you took something away from this post.

Best to you.
 
Okay, I'll ask a pretty broad question: when one loses weight, but is still not happy with their body in the mirror (dubbed 'skinny-fat'), doing weight lifting and building muscle is the idea step, right?

Peace.
 
Yup, you got it.

I mean what's the alternative? Keep losing. I've seen a number of people get to that point and they opt to keep losing. But when your arms and legs are the size of pencils and your face begins to sink in... well... that's just not healthy. And I'm sure that's not the look people are going for.

I've found that most don't reach a point where they're content and ready to maintain. They reach a point they're happy with assuming they're consistent in following a logical plan... but they continually try and improve.

Improvements come by way of losing fat and gaining muscle. They're really the only two variables that are in our control, right? I mean we're not going to be lengthening our muscles anymore than we're lengthening our bones... so changing the shapes of our bodies isn't likely (unless you're talking about going from round to slim... but that's not what I mean).
 
I received a PM from a fellow member recently and rather than keeping the convo private, he agreed we should post it in one of the stickies. I thought this one would be appropriate.

After a decent cutting phase with minimal lifting, I've been getting back into building again. I've been going over the stickies to make sure I'm getting things right, but I'm worried that other methods I've learned may be conflicting or sending me in the wrong direction.

Here's what I understand of body building at the moment; can you clarify any errors I have or highlight anything I'm missing?

Sure.

- medium weight, (75-85% of max)

That's a general rule, yes. When you're in a caloric surplus (hence "body building"), you have the capacity to chase some heavier weights now and again.

When I'm "bulking," the vast majority of my volume is spent in the 75-85% range. However, as my strength peaks, I'll bump that up to 90-95+% range too.

- ~8-12 reps, 2-5 reps per exercise

I'm assuming you meant 2-5 sets of 8-12 reps, right?

Assuming yes, this isn't written in stone. There is no magical rep range that is conducive in all situations.

Think of it like this.

I can grow lifting on something like 3x8 or 8x3 as long as all the foundational principles discussed earlier in this thread are in place.

Hypertrophy is mostly a response to the progressive application of "heavy enough" weights with sufficient volume. How that volume is delivered (in sets and reps) is really secondary.

Some argue there is an optimal "rep range" for growth and they're probably right. But limiting yourself to that probably isn't the best bet.

Just to note, that rep range is most likely someplace between 5-8 reps for most people.

- ~3 exercises per workout, all targeting same muscle group

Nah, that's not necessary.

Exercise selection is arbitrary.

As I said above, adequate intensity and volume is what's necessary.

Adequate intensity tends to be anything between 75-85% and average volume tends to be roughly 30-60 reps per part at least twice per week.

If all I did was bench press for chest with sufficient volume and intensity, my chest wouldn't know I was doing barbell bench press and not dumbbell bench press, barbell bench press, and cable flys.

It would only know that your nervous system had to recruit the muscle fibers of your chest (and triceps and shoulders) to generate enough tension to overcome the weight on the bar for 30-60 total reps.

Follow that?

Granted, I do like to vary my exercise selection but not b/c it's necessary.

- roughly 10-20 grams of protein post work-out

Sure, it could help. But again, not necessary. When you're adding muscle, you're eating more than your body needs and when that's the case, getting adequate amounts of protein overall is the overwhelmingly important factor. Not the timing of it.

Sounds like you've been reading a lot of bodybuilding mags and/or websites recently... is that true? If so, be mindful that those "circles" tend to disregard science and worship brotology.

- Switch up exercises to avoid plateaus

Again, not necessary. You can, but not at all necessary.

For instance, you can vary load, volume, etc and break through plateaus just as easily.

I read in your sticky that working out until failure and other things commonly perpetuated just aren't that important.

Muscular failure has more to do with your neurological system than your muscles.

But what is the fundamental concept behind bodybuilding?

Eating adequate calories and nutrients coupled with adding more weight to the bar with sufficient volume over time.

That's about as simple as I can put it.

It's not rocket science.
If strength training is using more and more weight for your muscles to adapt to lifting, then what affects the size of your muscles?

Getting stronger, assuming you're eating sufficiently, will ultimately mean getting bigger. Does that answer this question? Or are you looking for more detail?

Because I was under the impression that it was endurance (or that's what I gathered from my former coach), e.g. burning out, going 'till you feel 'the burn' and so on.

That would be 100% wrong.

I can use pink dumbbells and eventually "feel the burn" but the weight will never be sufficient in forcing my muscles to grow. Why? Because as I noted previously... sufficient tension in the muscle is what causes a positive growth response and no amount of burning is going to force those pink dumbbells to break the intensity threshold that'll provide me said tension.
 
To add to what steve says and to go a bit more in depth about rep ranges:

Fact 1) your body has a set number of muscle fibers, you cannot change this number. you can make those individual fibers grow or shrink in size, but the number you're born with is the number you're stuck with for life. This is why we talk about "gifted genetics" or born to play a particular sport. some people are just blessed with a certain genetic muscular makeup that allows them to excel in certain areas.

Fact 2) Of these set numbers of muscles you have, you will have certain types. Type I, Type II a fibers, Type II x fibers, Type II b fibers, etc etc. Which muscle is active for doing work in the body depends on intensity of work being performed. They work together to a degree, but are also specialized at certain things. When lifting VERY heavy weights, type II b will be the ones that are primary activated, while Type I will not activate at all for example.

Fact 3) The muscle fibers used for doing extreme intensity work are the largest fibers in the body (type IIb). conversely, those fibers used for doing cardio type work are the smallest(type I).


Now, with these 3 facts in mind, i'm hoping you're starting to see the theory's behind rep ranges and hypertrophy. Here's the golden rule, if you're getting bigger, you're getting stronger. If you're getting stronger, you're getting bigger. (this is assuming you're past the noob gains phase, which isn't muscular strength gains, but cns adaptation and muscular motor neuron control for the most part)

Now, once again to reiterate, you're born with a set # of muscle fibers. As a general rule, you will have more type II x than type II b. Type II x are the fibers that are activated to do moderately heavy lifting, like in the 8-12 rep range. This is where the rule of you can get big, you can get strong, but you can't get both comes from. To get biiiggg, you need to focus the not as big, but more plentiful muscle fibers in order to get maximum possible growth. To get strong, while you will get decently big since type II b are large muscles, you won't maximize your growth because the bulk of your training will be targeting muscles that don't have the numerical volume as Type IIx. However, this is not to say you should ignore certain rep ranges. As pointed out, Type II b are the largest muscle fibers in the body, maximizing your overall growth to some degree means we should be maximizing these fibers too. And not to mention, cardio conditioning and muscular endure offer a host of health benefits that while not making you bigger or stronger per say, will aid in a variety of areas like recovery, blood flow, endurance, etc and should not be ignored.

So as you can see, for what rep range to work out in, well work out with the rep ranges that will grow your largest muscles in your body. Meaning exercise in the 1-12 rep range. It only makes sense that you might as well target all muscles that give you the possibility to maximize growth.

To expand on this, DO NOT READ BODY BUILDING MAGAZINES. AND FOR SURE NEVER DO A BODY BUILDING SPLIT. The one muscle group a day idea is so outdated it's retarded. Instead look to more accomplished scientists. The split steve is laying out is almost a carbon copy of the foundation and fundamentals of Starting Strength. So I give props to Steve since Starting Strength is widely recognized as the best foundation for anyone who is starting lifting. Staying in the 8-12 rep range only is terribly outdated, and no longer recognized as the best method for lifters trying to gain. A proper training template will incorporate strength training as well into it. To hammer this point home, Ronnie Coleman does exclusive strength training 2 days a week.

Now, what about if you want to lose weight? I've been talking all this time about gaining. Well as we all know, the golden rule is calories in < calories out. And one of the things we do by exercise is increase calories out. These same principles of intensity can effect caloric burn as well. Again, as a general rule, without going into too much detail, doing types of exercise that target Type I (extended period of time, low intensity) muscle fibers are very efficient. While doing exercises that target type IIb fibers are very inefficient. The energy systems needed to provide energy for the larger muscles to work require a HUGE caloric demand. The best way I can describe it is when you do cardio, you're running on a honda 4 cylinder sipping gas for calories. When you're doing heavy squats, or oly lifting, you're running on a Ferrari 12 cylinder blasting down the road getting 2 miles to the gallon for calories. Bigger muscle fiber types doing intense work require more calories to move. simple as that. But there is little need to focus exclusively on the intense exercises, a proper training template for overall health and cardio vascular conditioning should include intensity's for all muscles. A proper balance is valuable after all.

So to sum up, if your goal is hypertrophy, do exercises that target all muscle types. If your goal is fat loss, do exercises that target all muscle types.
 
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Fact 2) Of these set numbers of muscles you have, you will have certain types. Type I, Type II a fibers, Type II x fibers, Type II b fibers, etc etc.

Type IIb fibers have been found to not exist in humans.



IIb was referred to for quite awhile because of animal models, but humans don't actually express that particular variant of the protein.

More recent research has found that we express IIx, which is similar, but still a different protein.

The confusion gets compounded by the fact that fibers expressing IIx don't even correlate to "active" muscles - IIx expression actually correlates with detraining or unused fibers.

For awhile it was thought that MHC IIx played a similar role as IIb in animals, i.e., fast contraction/rapid shortening. However, it seems that any exercise creates a preferential shift towards IIa expression in type II MUs. The consensus is that IIx really doesn't have much role in human movement anyway, despite being the "fastest" isoform we have.

This is all a bunch of theoretical wanking anyhow that matters little. I just wanted to make sure you had the most current information at your hands, Jynus, since you wanted to get "in depth" as you noted.

Which muscle is active for doing work in the body depends on intensity of work being performed.

Sure, intensity is certainly a primary dictator of how much and what motor units will be called upon.

However, so is duration or time under tension. By that, I mean even a "light weight" done for sufficient amounts of time will tap into higher threshold motor units as fatigue accumulates.

When lifting VERY heavy weights, type II b will be the ones that are primary activated, while Type I will not activate at all for example.

Not quite.

Just b/c intensity is high doesn't mean only the higher threshold motor units are called upon. It means the higher threshold motor units are called upon AS WELL AS all the lower threshold fibers.

The Size Principle still applies.
 
I was so happy to skip off to the gym with my newly gained knowledge that I forgot to thank you!

I've been gaining steadily since reading your post and have been slowly increasing weight with each workout. I've been mixing up volumes and rep/sets here and there to avoid plateauing and I've been downing near 4k calories per day. I was always under the assumption that strength and size had little or no correlation, but now that I'm getting both bigger and stronger it's easier to see the link (and understand the role of nutrition and caloric surplus).

On weekends when I don't gym, I run/hike 6 miles up a nearby canyon on rocks- mainly for the cardiovascular health benefits, but I notice it helps in cutting too. I assume that I'm metabolizing those 4k calories, and when I'm not doing body building exercises (and therefore eating roughly 3.5k) I continue to burn ~4k calories, creating a deficit. Couple that with all the water weight I lose and I have a hella six pack on Mondays, lol.

I've ditched the BB magazines, and I'm keeping it simple whilst going over these stickies and Googling things I don't understand completely. I seem to be going in the right direction so thanks very much for the invaluable insight!
 
Type IIb fibers have been found to not exist in humans.



IIb was referred to for quite awhile because of animal models, but humans don't actually express that particular variant of the protein.

More recent research has found that we express IIx, which is similar, but still a different protein.

The confusion gets compounded by the fact that fibers expressing IIx don't even correlate to "active" muscles - IIx expression actually correlates with detraining or unused fibers.

For awhile it was thought that MHC IIx played a similar role as IIb in animals, i.e., fast contraction/rapid shortening. However, it seems that any exercise creates a preferential shift towards IIa expression in type II MUs. The consensus is that IIx really doesn't have much role in human movement anyway, despite being the "fastest" isoform we have.

This is all a bunch of theoretical wanking anyhow that matters little. I just wanted to make sure you had the most current information at your hands, Jynus, since you wanted to get "in depth" as you noted.

Sure, intensity is certainly a primary dictator of how much and what motor units will be called upon.

However, so is duration or time under tension. By that, I mean even a "light weight" done for sufficient amounts of time will tap into higher threshold motor units as fatigue accumulates.
To clarify this for simplicity sake, since i'm like that. ;) under atp-cp work intensity, all muscles fibers will be active performing work at capacity, but the larger ones will be performing the brunt of the work. and as energy is depleted, the larger ones will not be as active and performance drops as the other muscles are forced to "carry the load" more so to speak. correct?

I always knew that all muscles were present and active to a degree when doing any sort of work. But I was basing their activation to correlate with energy systems used by the body for the given intensity. So my hypothetical example like during cardio your type 1 would be say 90% active, but during power lifting since type 1 are not a strength fiber would be "active" but at a way reduced output like 10% during the work.

Prob where the brunt of my confusion comes from cause I always assumed muscles were only active for specific intensity.

Not quite.

Just b/c intensity is high doesn't mean only the higher threshold motor units are called upon. It means the higher threshold motor units are called upon AS WELL AS all the lower threshold fibers.

The Size Principle still applies.
Glad the size principle still applies. Learned something new today though, thx. I can see the science is always advancing, what you said differs from what I was taught. It's always a good day when you're a lil wiser. :D
 
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To clarify this for simplicity sake, since i'm like that. ;) under atp-cp work intensity, all muscles fibers will be active performing work at capacity, but the larger ones will be performing the brunt of the work.

Sort of.

All the MUs that are called upon, which at high intensities will be nearly all of them, are firing at their full potential... hence the all-or-none principle.

You're right, without the higher threshold MUs firing, we wouldn't be able to move the weight or run as fast or whatever activity it is we're talking about. But still, all MUs are contributing to their full capacity.

What percentage of work is coming from higher threshold vs. lower threshold MUs... now that would be hard to say.

and as energy is depleted, the larger ones will not be as active and performance drops as the other muscles are forced to "carry the load" more so to speak. correct?

Yea, once phosphocreatine system becomes depleted and metabolic byproducts begin to accumulate, performance will drop.

I always knew that all muscles were present and active to a degree when doing any sort of work. But I was basing their activation to correlate with energy systems used by the body for the given intensity. So my hypothetical example like during cardio your type 1 would be say 90% active, but during power lifting since type 1 are not a strength fiber would be "active" but at a way reduced output like 10% during the work.

See above.

All-or-none still applies.

It's not that the higher threshold fibers are working harder and the lower threshold fibers are working lesser. They're all working to their greatest extent possible. The degree to which said work is contributing to the weight being lifted is what's hard to determine. At least I haven't seen any data on that... which isn't to say it doesn't exist.

May seem like semantics but I want to make sure you see what I'm saying.

Glad the size principle still applies. Learned something new today though, thx. I can see the science is always advancing, what you said differs from what I was taught. It's always a good day when you're a lil wiser. :D

Shit, I have text books that are a year or two old that are "outdated" by current research standards. It's amazing the pace at which this field functions at. Exciting and frustrating at the same time, lol.

I try and learn something new every single day.

Why not take advantage of the information we have at our fingertips?
 
Steve. Love the way you have broken this down. My only concern is I am out of Gym range & the only weights I have are a barbell(a standard bench bar won't fit in my small room :[ ) and some old weights to throw on em. I currently only do bench(Yes with the bar bell, is this a concern?) & curls. Any advice? Could you point me toward a weight set that I could get a complete workout with? Thanks a bunch.
 
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There are all sorts of movements you can do while applying the aforementioned fundamentals.

Floor Press
Overhead Press
Bent-over Rows
Romanian Deadlifts
Deadlifts
Lunges
Single Leg Squats
Bulgarian Split Squats

Just those alone would get the job done.
 
Steve, you rock. Thank you for taking the time to post this.

Now, I read everything and I'm still not sure I'm doing things the right way.

I'm a smallish woman (5'1', 106 lbs more or less), I'm too skinny - fit but skinny. If I understood correctly, weight lifting is what I need to get "a bit bigger".

Right now, I'm sort of following that example routine you posted (all with dumbbells, because it's all I have):

Squat 5 sets x 10 reps
Upright row (instead of row) 5 sets x 10 reps
Bench 5 sets x 10 reps
Standing calf rise 3 sets x 10 (per leg)

I plan on doing this 4 times a week with 1.5 kgs dumbeblls.

If I understood correctly, provided I give enough overload, my muscles should grow, right?

Or am I screwing this up somewhere?

Oh and: resistance bands work for growing muscle?
 
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Steve, you rock. Thank you for taking the time to post this.

You're welcome.

I'm a smallish woman (5'1', 106 lbs more or less), I'm too skinny - fit but skinny. If I understood correctly, weight lifting is what I need to get "a bit bigger".

And a calorie surplus.

You can't create something out of nothing, so you need the incoming energy to support new growth if you're going to make an attempt at it. Of course this isn't a license to gorge on junk but it does mean you need to eat more than you currently are.

How much?

Hard to say. A very general and rough guess might be 10% more.

Right now, I'm sort of following that example routine you posted (all with dumbbells, because it's all I have):

Squat 5 sets x 10 reps
Upright row (instead of row) 5 sets x 10 reps
Bench 5 sets x 10 reps
Standing calf rise 3 sets x 10 (per leg)

The upright row is not a fair replacement for rows. I'd opt for .

I plan on doing this 4 times a week

I'd actually change some things if I were tying to increase muscle and wanted to lift 4x per week. Realize that the original post was in response to a woman asking for help with fat loss.

with 1.5 kgs dumbeblls.

If I understood correctly, provided I give enough overload, my muscles should grow, right?

Right. But do you really feel that 2-3 lb dumbbells are going to overload your muscles? Especially your large muscles that are used to handling your bodyweight?

And secondly, how do you plan on progressing said overload? Remember, progression needs to be paired with overload.
Or am I screwing this up somewhere?

Oh and: resistance bands work for growing muscle?

Anything that forces your muscles to work harder than they're accustomed to will cause growth, assuming diet is in check. That said, bands aren't ideal for a number of reasons including the fact that during the initial phase of the lift there's much less tension than there is at the latter stages of the lift due to the elastic nature of the bands.

Plus, again, progressive overload isn't the easiest with bands.

Bands have their place and if it's all you have.... so be it. I'm just stating their not ideal to train solely with.
 
So I shouldn't rely on the resistance bands. I had a feeling you were going to say that. :)

Thank you for all the tips, Steve, appreciate it. I'm replacing the upright row with DB row (thanks for the video, last thing I want is to mess up my back, I'm being very careful with all this).

Yeap, I'm eating more, protein mostly. I found out it's hard eating more and have it all be healthy though.

I see your point about 1.5 kg not being enough. It was all I had at the moment. I'm going to buy dumbbells of 2 kg and 4 kg and see how those go. You think that would be enough to start?

Maybe it won't work but over the years I've realized my muscles grow quite fast when I work 1 muscle group a lot. I notice this while I was not losing fat so, it wasn't a case of "I lost fat and the muscles just showed more".

I'd actually change some things if I were tying to increase muscle and wanted to lift 4x per week. Realize that the original post was in response to a woman asking for help with fat loss.

Uh-oh...change what exactly? Last thing I want is getting thinner right now. But I don't want to eat and gain fat back either. :S
 
Yeap, I'm eating more, protein mostly. I found out it's hard eating more and have it all be healthy though.

Protein is the most satiating macro so I wouldn't load up on it too much or it WILL be hard to get "enough" calories in. Protein requirements actually go down slightly when you're trying to add weight. This is the case primarily due to the fact that preserving muscle isn't as big a concern when you're eating enough.

1 or so grams per pound of lean body mass would be optimal, assuming you're a healthy individual.

I see your point about 1.5 kg not being enough. It was all I had at the moment. I'm going to buy dumbbells of 2 kg and 4 kg and see how those go. You think that would be enough to start?

Ideally you'd purchase some sort of adjustable DB that allows you to add weight.

If you have limit yourself to one or two pairs of fixed weight dumbbells, here are the primary issues:

1) You'll be stronger in different movements that use different muscles than others. For instance, the legs are much stronger than the chest. So in theory, they should be able to handle much more weight than the chest/arms.

2) Having only a handful of fixed weights doesn't allow for progressive overload. Not easily anyhow. Read about progressive overload in the original post again.

Uh-oh...change what exactly? Last thing I want is getting thinner right now. But I don't want to eat and gain fat back either. :S

I'm not suggesting what you're doing is going to make you thin. But if muscle growth was my primary concern at the moment, I'd probably jack up the volume a bit for each muscle group and spread it out into something like an upper/lower split where your upper body is getting hit twice per week as well as your lower body.
 
Sorry I didn't reply before, Steve, Christmas and New Year Twister scooped me up spun me around. It just spat me back out.

Thank you for your time and all the information.

Sadly, fixed weights are about all I can afford right now. 4kg with an option to 8kg (they're these cheap things you fill with either water, sand or something else I don't remember).

I'm not suggesting what you're doing is going to make you thin. But if muscle growth was my primary concern at the moment, I'd probably jack up the volume a bit for each muscle group and spread it out into something like an upper/lower split where your upper body is getting hit twice per week as well as your lower body.

I'm going to do as you say, see how my body responds.

Again, thank you for your time, I really appreciate it. :D
 
Well you have to make due with what you have available. Just keep in mind that progression is necessary if your body is going to adapt - as in build more muscle. You have to provide the stimulus for such an event to occur and that comes by way of placing a stress on your muscles above and beyond what they're accustomed to. Said stress must be progressed overtime via manipulations of intensity and volume.

I'd keep your eye open on things like ebay, newspaper listings, and craigslist for used weights that can typically be picked up relatively cheaply.

There are adjustable dumbbells that work out great... they're just mini barbells that allow you to add and subtract weight plates. Sort of like this as a quick example without doing any sort of searching:
 
Awesome Information - Question

Wow, I have exercised all of my life, and now this has all become so much more simple!! Thank you so much for taking the time to post this wealth of information. Now I really GET IT!

On to my question: I want to lose weight and gain muscle. So if I'm understanding correctly, I need to focus on less calories and otherwise follow the program you have outlined. Is that correct?

I have varying DB weights, so that is not a problem. Would you suggest that I buy a chin up bar as well, or is there another exercise I can do that will work the same muscle group?

Machelle
 
Wow, I have exercised all of my life, and now this has all become so much more simple!! Thank you so much for taking the time to post this wealth of information. Now I really GET IT!

On to my question: I want to lose weight and gain muscle. So if I'm understanding correctly, I need to focus on less calories and otherwise follow the program you have outlined. Is that correct?

I have varying DB weights, so that is not a problem. Would you suggest that I buy a chin up bar as well, or is there another exercise I can do that will work the same muscle group?

Machelle

Gaining muscle and losing fat concurrently isn't a goal I'd advise shooting for. In *very* general terms, gaining muscle requires and excess of energy and losing fat requires a shortage of energy. Of course people have accomplished both simultaneously but it typically happens in those who are a) overly fat, b) very untrained, or c) both.

Anyhow, especially in women, losing fat while maintaining muscle (or even gaining a bit) goes a long way in establishing the appearance many are going for (the lean/tone look).

But yeah, what I outlined here, the conceptual side of things, is most likely what's in store for you, without knowing your specific details.. It doesn't need to be followed to a "T" as I'm against The Program mentality. My intent was to show a snapshot of the big picture.
 
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