squat stance controvoursy

P

Proteinboy

2
i came across an article in T nation from the technique sticky, proclaiming a wide squat stance is the way to go
We teach everyone at Westside to squat wide. We don't believe in a close-stance squatter. When you squat wide you create better leverages for the squat. The distance between your knee and hip is greater with a close stance, thus a longer and more difficult squat.

By using a wide squat you cut this distance back as well as place the emphasis on the glutes, hamstrings and lower back. These are the muscles that squat big weights! While squatting wide, try to keep your toes straight ahead or slightly turned out. This will create a tremendous amount of tension in the hips and glutes and make it hard to squat down. This tension will create a great stretch reflex out of the bottom of the squat. This is vital to the development of barbell speed.
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lolz that doesnt make sense how he says it makes for a harder squat. i know that i always struggle more with the same weight with a close, more olympic style squat than with a wide sumo squat stance.
plus, i cannot go ATG with a very wide stance. is that normal? i can go much lower with an olympic style stance(about shoulder width)
in addition, the shoulder width stance is a more natural, sports incorporated movement, isnt it? you dont jump with your legs far apart in sumo position, nor run.

iv read in oly lifting articles that a wide stance doesnt build strength as well either. olympic squats are used by oly lifters, the strongest guys in the world(imo)
furthermore, the wide stance squat in powerlifting is primarily used to be able to move more weight, correct?

what are your views on squat stance?
 
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Well, I'm a powerlifter, and while I'm in school lifting they make us lift with the shoulder width stance, so that we gain more actual strength. But, while I'm powerlifting, I find that it is easier to lift with a wide stance because it somewhat feels like there is more support underneath you.

I tend to try to use the wide stance more, even though it isnt as good. = /
 
Both have their benefits. A wide stance will ^^^^ you up if you try to go ATG. Don't do it. You will probably not be able to squat as much oly as opposed to pl style. If you can squat 500 lbs pl style, you can probably squat 300 oly easy. If you squat 300 oly easy you probably won't be able to squat 500 pl. Both are good to pursue.

Squatting wide also helps incorporate the gear pl'ers use. Briefs, squat suits, etc.
 
once you have worked with wide stance for a while you will be able to do more weight that way to parallel than with a narrow stance parallel squat.

Lei what makes you think that:
If you can squat 500 lbs pl style, you can probably squat 300 oly easy. If you squat 300 oly easy you probably won't be able to squat 500 pl. Both are good to pursue.
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I've seen tons of parallel squatters fall on their ass with trying oly squats with much lower weight than their parallel squats.
 
Which is why I said a 500 pl squatter might be able to oly 300. Parallel doesn't exactly equal powerlifting. Powerlifting, like the quoted article mentioned, makes you very strong in those regions. OLY squatting doesn't hit them like Pl squatting does. You will not see an olympic lifter pl squat much much more than his oly squat.

But again, it's good to train both.
 
I didn't say oly squatters will squat much more with a PL squat, they don't train that movement, so they obviously won't. I just don't think .. well, bah, just forget it. I just think the example is a bit ^^^^ed. since the 500lbs PL squatter will obviously be stronger.
 
alright, cool beans. thanks for the info guys i see what your saying. i personally think sumo squats are much easier even though you use more weight. ATG is just killer lulz :]
 
Karky said:
I didn't say oly squatters will squat much more with a PL squat, they don't train that movement, so they obviously won't. I just don't think .. well, bah, just forget it. I just think the example is a bit ^^^^ed. since the 500lbs PL squatter will obviously be stronger.
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Are you conceding that I am right :hug2:
 
PB, in answer to the original post.

that doesnt make sense how he says it makes for a harder squat. i know that i always struggle more with the same weight with a close, more olympic style squat than with a wide sumo squat stance.
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He is talking about the close stance squat when he say it's longer and more difficult.

i cannot go ATG with a very wide stance. is that normal? i can go much lower with an olympic style stance(about shoulder width)
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The article is about how they train at Westside. They only box squat. The only time they do not use a box is when they are in contest. ATG is not a good plan with a wide stance and a box should be used in order to prevent any problems. (like jman's right knee)

You should be able to go lower with an Olympic squat.

the shoulder width stance is a more natural, sports incorporated movement, isnt it?
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Squatting in general is used to strengthen the legs. An Olympic style or a wide stance box squat style are should be chosen based upon the athletes weaknesses. Sometimes a wide stance squat will be better, sometimes an Olympic squat will be better.

I know many people who have made great progress using wide box squats and assistance exercises to increase the strength of the posterior chain.

On the flip side, I know a lot of guys who have had better results from using the Olympic squat.

iv read in oly lifting articles that a wide stance doesnt build strength as well either.
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Powerlifting articles will tell you the exact opposite. Everyone has their side.

olympic squats are used by oly lifters, the strongest guys in the world(imo)
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Except the best OL are not strong enough to beat the best PL in powerlifting. On the flip. The best PL are not strong enough to beat the best OL in Olympic lifting. On a third note. The best strongmen don't beat the best OL and PL in olympic lifting and powerlifting. And, the best Ol and PL do not beat the best strongmen at strongman.

Strength is very specific. There is not "strongest guys" just guys that are strongest in their particular discipline.

the wide stance squat in powerlifting is primarily used to be able to move more weight, correct?
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Yes. The wide stance puts you in a better and stronger position to lift more weight.

what are your views on squat stance?
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Do both. Do Olympic squats. Do wide squats. Do box squats, both wide and close stance. Use a box set at different heights.

Quality variation is what builds well rounded strength. There is not reason to cut any type of squat out of a program. Just use each squat for what it is and get better.

:beerchug:
 
LeiYunFat said:
Are you conceding that I am right :hug2:
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I'm saying it is a ****ty example. :p It will be easier to go down in weight (like the PLer does) than up in weight (like the weightlifter does)

and like G said, strength is specific, best PL can't beat best OL at Oling and so on. What squat you do more with is also a lot about how you train. I've been doing oly squats for a while so I tried wide PL squats and I had to go down 20kg. I'm just not used to using the hip so much in that way. Though I know that with the PL squat I will eventually be able to move more weight if I train it. It has more potential for lifting big weights. However, it won't get you out of the hole on a clean or snatch since it is not low enough to catch.
 
I am hopping into this but just wanted to add from the very original post that the guys over at T-Nation (awesome site and trainer) that the wide stance squat puts more emphasis on the glutes and hams... The squat is meant to be quad dominant exercise anyway. If you wanted to put more emphasis on the glutes and hams that would be the deadlift.

Just my two cents and would like to hear what you think.
 
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