Personal Trainer Help
- Thread starter j0ni
- Start date
Haha - This always amazed me. I have never understood how a coach/trainer can allow him/herself to become overweight. Look at your eagles head coach. I don't see how he could maintain respect from his players when he has them out there running laps while he himself is obese.
I mean nothing bad by saying this. But, I personally couldn't respect a doctor, personal trainer, coach and so on if they were largely overweight. It simply seems so hypocritical.
I respect knowledge.
I don't care what package it comes in.
If you're a good coach, yet you're fat, does that mean I'm going to not hire you b/c you're fat and go with a less competent coach simply 'because'?
I don't get that rationality.
I agree, as a personal trainer, I think it's in a trainer's best interest to walk the walk and talk the talk, so to say. Not only is it your job to educate and train.... it's also to act as a role model.
But not acting the part doesn't erase knowledge, experience, and expertise.
And that's what I truly value.
I see a coach and a personal trainer as just about one and the same.
two examples,
This reminds me of a time when I saw a man on fox news talking about heart disease. He was a doctor and was clinically obese. He was talking about how Americans don't know how to eat right, exercise, and live a healthy life. At the same time, you could hear him struggle for air.
I was played on a football team where the head coach was highly over weight. He was a prick and hard ass who had us run till we could run no more(not in a good way). It was not enjoyable to be sprinting in 98+ degree Texas weather in football uniforms while this VERY overweight man tells us we don't know how to push our selfs, were lazy, and were not in good enough shape and so on. Yet, this man couldn't run goal to goal if he tried.
I say lead by example. If your going to be in a position of power where you are professionally advising someone else in an athletic situation or in general health. You can't say - "Do as I say, Not as I do".
Lead by example is what I believe in and I don't like hypocrites.
As do I.
When I originally said coach, I was more talking about a strength coach. But either or works.
You're missing my point.
How does his inability to breath or his obvious lack of health discredit his information?
The only problem I see here is that he called you lazy.
He himself is obviously lazy.
The doctor above wasn't like, "America is full of a bunch of fat asses." He was simply explaining the correlation between obesity and heart disease.
A coach of any general sport has a job. This job entails preparation of athletes, winning, etc. What does his/her weight have to do with his job? He/she doesn't need to be able to run wind sprints in 98 degree weather.... b/c that's not his job. His job is to be a effective coach.
How about this:
How would a lean coach help his/her athlete any better than than any equally competent heavy coach?
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree here, as I don't agree with this at all.
Certainly in certain circumstances I do.
For instance, if you had an uber wealthy president saying, "We are going to tax the poor and reward the rich"..... yea, there's a serious lack of sense there.
However, in the case of the trainer/coach, I just don't see it. If they know their shit....they know their shit. What you're saying here lacks reason in the context of the question I asked you previously.
Suppose you were looking for a trainer and somehow could automatically be made aware of his/her competency.
Heavy trainer = more intelligent and effective than lean trainer.
Would you go with the lean trainer simply b/c he 'leads by example' when you certainly would have gotten better results with the fat trainer?
I understand what you're saying, I really do. I just don't think the whole 'lead by example' thing is strictly black and white. There's a lot of gray where you can have a fat, yet highly effective and competent coach.
You aren't paying for the way the trainer looks. You are paying for the results that he/she can get you.
You're missing my point.
Not what I'm arguing.
Again, Your missing my point. I'm not saying they can't be as knowledgeable in the area. I never once stated they can't/aren't as knowledgeable. It's a matter of principle.
I still say and stand by...
If you can't fire a gun affectively. I'm not going to hire you to teach me how to shoot a gun. If you can't ski well. I'm not going to pay to teach me. If you can't keep yourself in decent physical shape. I'm not going to hire you as a trainer or any other position where you are telling ME how to "Be better" when you yourself can't follow your own advise.
Its not a matter of intelligence. Its a matter of principle.
Not at all actually. I know this b/c you solidified your point below and I'll get to that in a moment.
No.
Oh I see....
You are confusing my point with your own.
I never said you said this. I was making my point which you warped.
From the get-go I've said I see your point and even said this to be your point.
Again, I see what you mean WITH YOUR POINT: It is a positive thing for a trainer/coach to walk the walk, talk the talk.
I'm just not one to get hung up on something as trivial as principle when there are much more critical things that would go into the hire of a trainer, IMO.... such as intelligence. This is my point, Trevor.
Right.
I'm honestly a pretty intelligent guy. I've realized and comprehended your point from the get go. I don't agree with said point, which is why I stated we'll have to agree to disagree in this particular case. No biggy.
We're weren't talking about the principle of it all.
We were talking about the efficacy of trainers.
If I were to hire a trainer, it would have nothing to do with how he lives his life. It would have everything to do with what he could do for me in terms of goal attainment. Him being fat has no bearing on the results he can help me acheive.
You would make your decisions on different variables.
To each his own.... we're all entitled and there isn't right or wrong.
And that sums it up.
I could care less about the principle b/c I don't really care about said trainer. I care about myself and said results. Again, I'm not paying for the trainer's looks, I'm paying for what's between his ears.
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Haha - I'm not and never have been.
A person who teaches and is payed to teach a subject that does not follow his own advise is lazy and hypocritical.
Pfft, Intelligent is an understatement to say the least.
Its just when you said, for example.
I presumed that you didn't get my point. As I have not questioned the validity of his information.
Its a matter of practicing what you preach. If you can't practice don't preach it.
Another comparison is cops who instruct us and condemn us yet give advise on how to follow the law. Yet, they go out and break it them selfs(not speaking in absolutes here). Or preachers who preach their bible yet go out and do horrible acts that go against their own book.
Its all the same. "Do as I say, Not as I do.
)I believe what were "arguing" is the exact same as the above two examples.
James2
New member
I've been staying out of it 'cause the discussion kinda touches on what I am. I have a belly, but I both coached highschool wrestling, and have designed weight training programs for others. I would like to step in here, though, and throw out some logic.
Where would you draw the line?
If you were to use/recommend a trainer, and you are saying that you wouldn't use a trainer that is overweight, what would be the line? Would that trainer have to have all of his abs visible? Would his bicep have to be a certain size? If you say that you are going to disqualify someone based on a quantifiable standard, then where is your balance point? Knowledge wise, you can set quantifiable standards by saying "they need to at least have this cert, or have read these books, or know not to recommend these programs".
If they were so grossly overweight that they couldn't follow you around and/or were so fat that they couldn't show you proper form, I would say that you have a valid point by disqualifying someone based on their level of fitness.
Like steve said, I completely understand your point and your arguments, but I disagree with you. I had a strength coach in college that was a big fat guy, but he could eek the last little bit of effort out of me, and get me to make my body do things that I didn't think it could do. I know it is anecdotal evidence, but to me, that just goes to show that just because a person doesn't necessarily practice what they preach doesn't mean that they aren't qualified.
Where would you draw the line?
If you were to use/recommend a trainer, and you are saying that you wouldn't use a trainer that is overweight, what would be the line? Would that trainer have to have all of his abs visible? Would his bicep have to be a certain size? If you say that you are going to disqualify someone based on a quantifiable standard, then where is your balance point? Knowledge wise, you can set quantifiable standards by saying "they need to at least have this cert, or have read these books, or know not to recommend these programs".
If they were so grossly overweight that they couldn't follow you around and/or were so fat that they couldn't show you proper form, I would say that you have a valid point by disqualifying someone based on their level of fitness.
Like steve said, I completely understand your point and your arguments, but I disagree with you. I had a strength coach in college that was a big fat guy, but he could eek the last little bit of effort out of me, and get me to make my body do things that I didn't think it could do. I know it is anecdotal evidence, but to me, that just goes to show that just because a person doesn't necessarily practice what they preach doesn't mean that they aren't qualified.
James2
New member
It sounds more like that you are against people (not necessarily trainers or coaches) that are lazy and hypocritical. Are you going to tell me that you've never smoked a cigarette, or drank a single beer, or jaywalked, or speeded in a car? You obviously knew beforehand that there were negative consequences of these sorts of actions, but you did them. Doesn't that make you a hypocrite?
1. I'm not arguing at all.
2. You entered my conversation... not vice versa. With that in mind, you entered a conversation about the efficacy of trainers and started talking about respect. You base your respect on how the life that the provider of information compares to the information itself.
This was apparent when you brought up your amazement wrt to trainers becoming overweight and how you couldn't respect them for doing this.
This, Trevor, is what I'm disagreeing with. My respect isn't based on how they look. It's based on what they know.
You stated, and I quote:
My point has and still is, my respect is based on something different than yours. That is all.
I'm a huge promoter of integrity of information, so I place a huge emphasis on said information and knowledge. We all have different values.
2. You entered my conversation... not vice versa. With that in mind, you entered a conversation about the efficacy of trainers and started talking about respect. You base your respect on how the life that the provider of information compares to the information itself.
This was apparent when you brought up your amazement wrt to trainers becoming overweight and how you couldn't respect them for doing this.
This, Trevor, is what I'm disagreeing with. My respect isn't based on how they look. It's based on what they know.
You stated, and I quote:
My point has and still is, my respect is based on something different than yours. That is all.
I'm a huge promoter of integrity of information, so I place a huge emphasis on said information and knowledge. We all have different values.
Haha - I'm not basing my "lack of respect" on looks. I'm basing it on character. Its hypocritical, thats all I'm saying. I don't like hypocrites. There for, I find it hard to respect a grossly obese trainer who thinks so highly of them selfs as to charge another on how to be "fit&healthy" yet can't maintain the same standards to them selfs.
If you can't apply a set standard to yourself. How can you be expected to apply them to someone els? Especially in the context of being paid to do so.
I'm not quite sure of your point. But, I do have something against lazy hypocrites. Mind you, Who doesn't may I ask?
I don't think thats a valid "comparison" at all. None the less, doing something while knowing its "negative" isn't hypocritical.
A. I might have smoked one cig in my entire life.
I don't smoke, Its not hypocritical of me to say "you shouldn't smoke". If I smoked on a regular basis than it would be hypocritical of me to say "quit smoking".
B. Honestly, I can't recall the last time I jaywalked. Regardless, I'm not a cop who gives tickets to people and jaywalks himself. That would be hypocritical.
C. Sure, Maybe by a few MPH but never recklessly or intensionally on a road with other drivers.
Again, even If I did that wouldn't be hypocritical. Me condemning some one else for speeding if I did it myself on a regular basis would be hypocritical.
None of these have been brought up in this discussion. So, not quite sure how they related to anything said here.
Conversation = over, at least for me.
I didn't say you are basing it on looks. I said I don't base my opinions on looks.
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Oh, Than I interpreted the below wrong, yes? No biggie
.In the context of your post with the above. I would assume you were insinuating that.
A hypocrisy dealing with trainers, IMO, would be a trainer telling someone HOW to lose weight when in reality, they know nothing about the human body or how it's done effectively/efficiently.
A fat trainer isn't a hypocrite just b/c he's fat. He never held himself out to be anything BUT fat, again, IMO.
A hypocrisy is a pretense of having character, beliefs, or principles that one does not really possess.
The trainer, in this particular context, isn't claiming to be something he's not or believe something he doesn't. Just b/c he chooses not be thin means nothing really when you factor in what the job of a trainer is. Not factoring in the job of a trainer is lunacy.
A fat trainer isn't a hypocrite just b/c he's fat. He never held himself out to be anything BUT fat, again, IMO.
A hypocrisy is a pretense of having character, beliefs, or principles that one does not really possess.
The trainer, in this particular context, isn't claiming to be something he's not or believe something he doesn't. Just b/c he chooses not be thin means nothing really when you factor in what the job of a trainer is. Not factoring in the job of a trainer is lunacy.
Oh, Than I interpreted the below wrong, yes? No biggie
In the context of your post with the above. I would assume you were insinuating that.
Assumptions and insinuations can get you into trouble when debating.
Trev, you can stick to the semantics all you want.
There's a much larger and critical point to this discussion. If you're debating to debate, which seems to be the case, please let me know up front as I have much better things to do today. I'm usually down for debate... but not today.
If you're not debating to debate..... then I'm pretty sure the horse has been beaten to death. You have an opinion. I have an opinion. They've both been expressed clearly. They aren't aligned.
Big whoop.
I'm not quite sure where the debate is. I'm simply saying practice what you preach. You don't believe you should have to practice what you preach. We disagree, there really is no debate
.I'm not trying to defend my side and either or you (I think). So, its more an "expressing of thoughts" than a debate. As we aren't trying to change one another's view, I don't think lol.
None the less, I agree with you fully on the intelligence of the trainer is of prime importance. I'm just a believer of practice what you preach (boy thats been said to many times in this one post.)
I'm not quite sure where the debate is. I'm simply saying practice what you preach. You don't believe you should have to practice what you preach. We disagree, there really is no debate
I'm not trying to defend my side and either or you (I think). So, its more an "expressing of thoughts" than a debate. As we aren't trying to change one another's view, I don't think lol.
None the less, I agree with you fully on the intelligence of the trainer is of prime importance. I'm just a believer of practice what you preach (boy thats been said to many times in this one post.)
Right, and all along I've been trying to see how your 'standard' would hold up in applicable situations.
That's why I asked and still wonder, "If trainer A was fat and great at training, and trainer B was ripped and okay at training, who would you go with?"
If you wanted to put it in terms that don't involve looks, since that seems to hang up the discussion, how about this:
"If trainer A doesn't practice what he preaches but is great at doing the job of a trainer, and trainer B practiced what he preaches but is okay at doing the job of a trainer, who would you go with?"
And as James was eluding to, how can you put a metric on said practice of preachings? If the metric isn't looks, which is what the original discussion was about and what my original point was about, what metric do you use?
I know a few trainers that don't practice what they preach but they certainly look the look when it comes to being a trainer. They smoke and eat like shit but they're blessed with the genetic card. Based on your values of practiced preachings, what metric would weed out said trainers from the others? This isn't as important a question, but I'm still curious.
You assuming the person has preexisting knowledge of their trainers "talent" level. I'm not...
IF person A walks into the gym. Sees two trainers, onces fat and ones not. Who do you think they are going to go to first?
for me personally, I would hire neither. For the average person, I think the average person will go with the "more fit" of the pack. As, they don't know what makes a great trainer. They see an two individuals competing for your money. One keeps himself in shape the other doesn't, and thats ALL they know. Who would you rather trust your money to in this situation?
My "method"? Knowing what I know I would easily be able to tell which trainer is the "better" in terms of knowledge and so forth. And for that reason, I wouldn't need a trainer in the first place.
HOWEVER, If I knew nothing about these "arts" my "practice what they preach" would weed out the highly overweight trainers. My first impression of a highly overweight trainer would be "this dude can't even keep himself fit. How in the world could he 'teach me' how to be fit"?
Thats a first impression of myself when I see a highly overweight trainer that I have know preexisting knowledge of.
I believe this would be the general first impression of most people.