Ok so my dad is trying to tell me not to continue with my 3 day a week, full body routine and to start lifting everyday. He claims that if you dont work "until it burns", then you will be able to recover in 24 hours. I told him all of this is wrong and that you shouldn't work out two days in a row (learned this from this website). Also, he thinks that I should run a mile or two every day (Keep in mind that I am trying to gain weight), and I think I should run about 5 miles once a week. Who is right in this situation?
Parents say that workoing out 6 days in a row is ok...
- Thread starter hoosiers15
- Start date
Well he used to do track and basketball in hs so he thinks that everything they did back in the day is still the right way.
oh yeah, does anybody have any studies or any other type of proof that i can show him on the net so he will believe me?
Your muscles need time to rest properly. If they do not rest they dont work to their fullest and grow. My triceps are still hurting after 2 days of rest, because I did a new exercise.
If you dont work out until you are sore then i dont see why you cant work out 6 days a week. That will just mean you arent getting any better. Muscles grow when tehy are torn and resting.
If you dont work out until you are sore then i dont see why you cant work out 6 days a week. That will just mean you arent getting any better. Muscles grow when tehy are torn and resting.
Look at any articles here:
EliteFTS - Superior Products and Knowledge for Lifters, Athletes, Coaches, and Trainers
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fitness.com/forum
EliteFTS - Superior Products and Knowledge for Lifters, Athletes, Coaches, and Trainers
t-nation.com
fitness.com/forum
6 fullbody days a week? it is possible, for lifters with experience, and routine design is crucial. Waterbury's HFT explains a bit about this, but if you're dad was thinking about that, he would have said so, because its pretty special. im using HFT principles to do 4 fullbody sessiones a week.
but basicly, he is wrong. keep doing 3 days a week.
but basicly, he is wrong. keep doing 3 days a week.
actually your father is correct you can train a muscle everyday no problem,its your CNS that will most likely fail first so you must lower the volume..ie..
instead of doing 5sets 3x a wk, you could do 2sets 7x a wk etc.
Title: Effects of a 7-day eccentric training period on muscle damage and inflammation.
Researchers: Chen TC, Hsieh SS.
Institution: Department of Ball-Related Sports Science, Taipei Physical Education College, Taipei City, Taiwan.
Source: Medicine and Science Sports & Exercise 2001 Oct;33(10):1732-8
Purpose: This study examined the effects of a 7-day repeated maximal isokinetic eccentric training period on the indicators of muscle damage and inflammatory response.
Methods: Twenty-two college-age males were randomly assigned to eccentric training (ET) and control groups (CON). The initial exercise was 30 repetitions of maximal voluntary isokinetic eccentric contraction (ECC1) on non-dominant elbow flexors with Cybex 6000 at 60 degrees.s-1 angular velocity. The ET group performed the same exercise for the following 6 consecutive days (referred to as ECC2 to ECC7) after ECC1. Upper arm circumference (CIR), range of motion (ROM), and maximal isometric force (MIF) were measured before, immediately after, and every 24 h for 7 consecutive days after ECC1. Plasma creatine kinase (CK), lactate dehydrogenase (LDH), glutamic oxaloacetate transaminase (GOT), leukocyte counts, and serum interleukin-1beta and -6 (IL-1beta, IL-6) levels were assessed before; at 2 h; and at 1, 3, 4, 6, and 7 d after ECC1. Muscle soreness was measured before and for 7 consecutive days after ECC1.
Results: The ECC1 produced significant changes in most of the measures for both groups, with the exception of leukocyte counts. No indicators of increased damage were found from the second consecutive day of eccentric training to the 7th day for the eccentric training group.
Conclusion: Continuous intensive isokinetic eccentric training performed with damaged muscles did not exacerbate muscle damage and inflammation after ECC1. In addition, a muscular "adaptation effect" may occur as early as 24 h after ECC1, as shown by the ET group's performance for 6 consecutive days after ECC1.
Discussion: One of the most controversial aspects of HST is the suggestion that people train in a predominantly eccentric fashion for two weeks straight. Heresy! they shout. Then when you ask them why it's so bad to train a muscle more frequently or, heaven forbid, do negatives two workouts in a row, they say because your muscle can't "recover" that fast. This study calls into question the belief that muscles can't recover if trained again soon or even the next day.
They looked at a wide variety of markers for muscle damage including plasma creatine kinase (CK), lactate dehydrogenase (LDH), glutamic oxaloacetate transaminase (GOT), leukocyte counts, and serum interleukin-1beta and -6 (IL-1beta, IL-6). Although both groups experienced a significant change in all these indicators (accept leukocyte count), no indicators of increased damage were found from ECC2 to ECC7 for the ET group.
What about soreness? For both the group who only did one training session as well as those who did seven in a row, muscle soreness developed 1 day after the first eccentric training bout, and remained through the 3rd day, then gradually diminished regardless of which group they were in. The group that did the eccentric sets every day experienced the same progression and subsidence of soreness as the group that did only one set at the beginning of the week. The soreness level was almost back to baseline on 7 day for both groups.
The results of this investigation indicated that repeated bouts of the eccentric exercise performed on each of the following 6 days after the first bout did not affect recovery from the first training bout. This is in agreement with a substantial amount of other studies indicating that muscle adapts effectively to physical load even when the loading is frequent or even continuous. Keep in mind that we are only talking about the physical recovery of the muscle. We are not talking about performance. After all, HST is "Hypertrophy-Specific" by design.
So once again, HST turns out not to be so outlandish, but instead, simply a derivative of the research. The results and the science, speak for themselves.
instead of doing 5sets 3x a wk, you could do 2sets 7x a wk etc.
Title: Effects of a 7-day eccentric training period on muscle damage and inflammation.
Researchers: Chen TC, Hsieh SS.
Institution: Department of Ball-Related Sports Science, Taipei Physical Education College, Taipei City, Taiwan.
Source: Medicine and Science Sports & Exercise 2001 Oct;33(10):1732-8
Purpose: This study examined the effects of a 7-day repeated maximal isokinetic eccentric training period on the indicators of muscle damage and inflammatory response.
Methods: Twenty-two college-age males were randomly assigned to eccentric training (ET) and control groups (CON). The initial exercise was 30 repetitions of maximal voluntary isokinetic eccentric contraction (ECC1) on non-dominant elbow flexors with Cybex 6000 at 60 degrees.s-1 angular velocity. The ET group performed the same exercise for the following 6 consecutive days (referred to as ECC2 to ECC7) after ECC1. Upper arm circumference (CIR), range of motion (ROM), and maximal isometric force (MIF) were measured before, immediately after, and every 24 h for 7 consecutive days after ECC1. Plasma creatine kinase (CK), lactate dehydrogenase (LDH), glutamic oxaloacetate transaminase (GOT), leukocyte counts, and serum interleukin-1beta and -6 (IL-1beta, IL-6) levels were assessed before; at 2 h; and at 1, 3, 4, 6, and 7 d after ECC1. Muscle soreness was measured before and for 7 consecutive days after ECC1.
Results: The ECC1 produced significant changes in most of the measures for both groups, with the exception of leukocyte counts. No indicators of increased damage were found from the second consecutive day of eccentric training to the 7th day for the eccentric training group.
Conclusion: Continuous intensive isokinetic eccentric training performed with damaged muscles did not exacerbate muscle damage and inflammation after ECC1. In addition, a muscular "adaptation effect" may occur as early as 24 h after ECC1, as shown by the ET group's performance for 6 consecutive days after ECC1.
Discussion: One of the most controversial aspects of HST is the suggestion that people train in a predominantly eccentric fashion for two weeks straight. Heresy! they shout. Then when you ask them why it's so bad to train a muscle more frequently or, heaven forbid, do negatives two workouts in a row, they say because your muscle can't "recover" that fast. This study calls into question the belief that muscles can't recover if trained again soon or even the next day.
They looked at a wide variety of markers for muscle damage including plasma creatine kinase (CK), lactate dehydrogenase (LDH), glutamic oxaloacetate transaminase (GOT), leukocyte counts, and serum interleukin-1beta and -6 (IL-1beta, IL-6). Although both groups experienced a significant change in all these indicators (accept leukocyte count), no indicators of increased damage were found from ECC2 to ECC7 for the ET group.
What about soreness? For both the group who only did one training session as well as those who did seven in a row, muscle soreness developed 1 day after the first eccentric training bout, and remained through the 3rd day, then gradually diminished regardless of which group they were in. The group that did the eccentric sets every day experienced the same progression and subsidence of soreness as the group that did only one set at the beginning of the week. The soreness level was almost back to baseline on 7 day for both groups.
The results of this investigation indicated that repeated bouts of the eccentric exercise performed on each of the following 6 days after the first bout did not affect recovery from the first training bout. This is in agreement with a substantial amount of other studies indicating that muscle adapts effectively to physical load even when the loading is frequent or even continuous. Keep in mind that we are only talking about the physical recovery of the muscle. We are not talking about performance. After all, HST is "Hypertrophy-Specific" by design.
So once again, HST turns out not to be so outlandish, but instead, simply a derivative of the research. The results and the science, speak for themselves.
Hoosier...your father engaged in endurance sports b-ball and track. You can train for those everyday because you WANT your body to be able to take that beating day in and day out. It's one of the big principles behind the sports...endurance endurance endurance.
Unfortunately though, it's not the same with weight training. YES, you can train 6 days in a row, but physically you will be drained and your gains won't come as fast because you won't have the energy and your CNS will be absolutely spent. Also, "resistance training" as a whole involves 3 pars: TRAINING, EATING, and RESTING. Miss out on a single one of those, and you are training for disaster.
Unfortunately though, it's not the same with weight training. YES, you can train 6 days in a row, but physically you will be drained and your gains won't come as fast because you won't have the energy and your CNS will be absolutely spent. Also, "resistance training" as a whole involves 3 pars: TRAINING, EATING, and RESTING. Miss out on a single one of those, and you are training for disaster.
tell that to mariuzs pudsinusky or any of the other worlds strongest men,
oly or powerlifters who train everyday.
as i said before its all about managing your training and as you said "TRAINING, EATING, and RESTING." which BTW even endurance athletes need to do.
You can train 6 days a week no probs, BUT you need to split it up. Only train a body part once or twice a week. Pro bodybuilders take so many supps and steroids they can do it but even those wont train Biceps 5 times a week. Eat right and rest it will be ok. If you hit a plateau up calories or rest for a week. All this depends on so many things but it is possible to make great gains training this way.
Someone once said there is no such thing as over training, just under eating. That has a certain truth to it.
Someone once said there is no such thing as over training, just under eating. That has a certain truth to it.
So that study indicates that CNS fatigue is what you really have to worry about.
Though i wish someone would do tests like that with something like 5x5 squat, row, bench.. etc.
yes CNS is what can easilly be overtrained.
yeah thats the impression i had. Thats why sleep is so importaint, also, when training frequently, dont do 10 sets to screaming faliure each workout, im doing 4 fullbody a week now (ok, one day might not be completley fullbody, but pretty darn close
) and im fine, but i always leave 1-2 reps "in the hole"Buzz...you know what I mean. You didn't have to take it that literally. Yes, any sort of training requires training, eating, and resting...but when doing resistance training...rest and eating play a MUCH bigger role in recovery.
And I also never said that you CAN'T train 6 days in a row...
yeah thats the impression i had. Thats why sleep is so importaint, also, when training frequently, dont do 10 sets to screaming faliure each workout, im doing 4 fullbody a week now (ok, one day might not be completley fullbody, but pretty darn close
yes not training to faliure is a good fatigue managment plan,also light,heavy,medium,days,high reps low weight,low reps high weight,etc.
It's all good...I know you have been around here for about as long as I have...so I didn't figure you meant to offend.
I just reposted because I wanted to clear up anything I may have wrote that was misleading or easily misunderstood.
I just reposted because I wanted to clear up anything I may have wrote that was misleading or easily misunderstood.