Oh no! Too much food!

[maleficent]

leaving the mind out of it for a moment -there's also the "shoulds" that many of us fall into - we Should do this and we should do that because the experts tell us so...

and I've read a bunch of different articles - that it's Ok to be hungry - hunger is what made every diet attempt in my past fail... but we SHOULD eat 1200 calories a day so therefore we SHOULD be hungry and that's normal...

I suppose it's one way to get out of the "emotional eating" trap by forcing yourself into a minimal amount of calories a day but I am not good with being hungry and I can honestly say in the past 18 months, I've not been hungry... if I were hungry - wars would be declared because it makes me grumpier than i am normally.

 

[Steve]

leaving the mind out of it for a moment -there's also the "shoulds" that many of us fall into - we Should do this and we should do that because the experts tell us so...

and I've read a bunch of different articles - that it's Ok to be hungry - hunger is what made every diet attempt in my past fail... but we SHOULD eat 1200 calories a day so therefore we SHOULD be hungry and that's normal...

I suppose it's one way to get out of the "emotional eating" trap by forcing yourself into a minimal amount of calories a day but I am not good with being hungry and I can honestly say in the past 18 months, I've not been hungry... if I were hungry - wars would be declared because it makes me grumpier than i am normally.

You know, I don't even waste my time listening to the 'experts' anymore. Nor do I read much of the marketing put in mags today.

Is there really an abundance of starvation-dieting promotion going on still?

 

[faith333]

same way an anorexic can convince themselves that they aren't hungry and they look skeletal.

and i'm not really comparing it to anorexia but the power of the mind and what it can convince a person of and make them do.

Actually that makes a lot of sense. Maybe the exhiliaration of initial rapid weight loss "overwhelms" any feelings of hunger.

And the comparison with eating disorders isn't off-track at all. That's how eating disorders start:
1. Unrealistic goals (about the amount you have to lose, or the speed of loss).
2. Strict diet yielding initial results.
3. Results slow down, or self-control fails.
4. Binge.
5. Throwing up, or an even stricter diet to compensate for the binge.

 

[maleficent]

I still read a lot because I'm always looking for ways to tweak and improve - especially when my frustration levels get higher like they are right now... low calorie diets are still big - 12-1500 calorie diets are the norm... probably because it seems to be a safe starting point for people... what I don't think that people do, is the adjustments as you go...

Most of the women's magazines on the checkout stands proclaim lose 10lbs in 10days or some other headline - and it's generally a low calorie diet - though they talk about food combining or some magic element that will makethem shed those lbs... it's a 2 week low calorie diet that they really don't say what to do after those 2 weeks.

Tweaking or making changes is rough - I know it is for me - I know I whined about it a few months back - when my calories were bumped up to 2500 per day and I stalled completely - my head knew i was in it for the long term and adjustments are ok but when you'd been successful at 2000 - and success was gone -it was hard... and even harder to get back to 2000 calories and find success again... I'm still not there... I work in IT, change is part of my life -I don't fear change.. but this was hard and continues to be hard....

 

[maleficent]

You know, I don't even waste my time listening to the 'experts' anymore. Nor do I read much of the marketing put in mags today.

One of my recent poison pen letters was to the editors of Women's health magazine - this is actually a pretty decent magazine - that covers food, exercise, and sexuality in an easy to understand way - and the editorial content doesn't promote unhealthy ways of achieving goals.

What drives me crazy though,, and what made me haul out my vocabulary and proper grammar was the amount of advertising that this magazine and the other fitness magazines do for diet pills and other unhealthy methods of weight loss.. Yeah I know they have to make money but - what tehy advertise goes against the healthy lifestyles they promote.

 

[JeremyRice]

You know, I don't even waste my time listening to the 'experts' anymore. Nor do I read much of the marketing put in mags today.

Is there really an abundance of starvation-dieting promotion going on still?

nor do i,

do what you feel is comfortable with you and what you can maintain long term.

i can maintain long term the amount i eat now.

do what works for u

 

[SweatPea]

By the depression diet, I'm assuming you ate next to nothing, right?

Pretty much.

 

[Steve]

Pretty much.

The thing is, after any form of starvation dieting, before I would start dieting using *sane* tactics again, I'd increase my cals up to maintenance over time and let them sit at maintenance. This will help things 'settle' metabolically speaking.

I'm assuming you didn't do this?

 

[SweatPea]

Well I wasn't on a starvation diet just to be on one. KWIM?

I did eat plenty to get back up to 174. Also during the severe parts of the depression, I would eat basically nothing - yogurt, a little of this, a little of that and then maybe I would have a meal from McDs or Wendy's. Of course at that time I wasn't thinking of eating or what I was eating really and I definitely did not care what my cals. were. My exercise was close to nill.

How long do you think one needs to be on maintenance cals? I haven't been on the "depression" diet for a year now - that was only about 6 mo. of eating close to nothing. I don't want to eat like that - I mean I totally know it's not healthy.

Even when I did lose weight - the normal way - it was forever and a day before it would come off. Except for at the very beginning.

My goal isn't too be some skinny super model - it's just to be flab free (or close to it.) Toned up tummy and arms and thighs.

 

[dariqueen]

I haven't read the rest of this thread yet b/c I'm lazy and like to hear myself talk.

I'm only halfway through reading the whole thread, but this really made me laugh out loud.

 

[Steve]

Well I wasn't on a starvation diet just to be on one. KWIM?

I did eat plenty to get back up to 174. Also during the severe parts of the depression, I would eat basically nothing - yogurt, a little of this, a little of that and then maybe I would have a meal from McDs or Wendy's. Of course at that time I wasn't thinking of eating or what I was eating really and I definitely did not care what my cals. were. My exercise was close to nill.

How long do you think one needs to be on maintenance cals? I haven't been on the "depression" diet for a year now - that was only about 6 mo. of eating close to nothing. I don't want to eat like that - I mean I totally know it's not healthy.

Even when I did lose weight - the normal way - it was forever and a day before it would come off. Except for at the very beginning.

My goal isn't too be some skinny super model - it's just to be flab free (or close to it.) Toned up tummy and arms and thighs.

You usually only need to be at maintenance a few weeks.

Are you sure your calories are accurate?

 

[dariqueen]

This has been a good read. I'm not sure I have anything to contribute that hasn't already been said.

I do know that while I have had the odd low calorie day where I wasn't hungry, most of the time I need more than that. The low cal days were when I had fruit for snack, chili for lunch, and soup for supper. I honestly felt full, and that was about 1,000 -1,100 calories. But I couldn't do that every day.

 

[SweatPea]

You usually only need to be at maintenance a few weeks.

Are you sure your calories are accurate?

I've been counting them on sparkpeople - and I do measure foods, so yeah I'm sure they are pretty close.

 

[Steve]

I've been counting them on sparkpeople - and I do measure foods, so yeah I'm sure they are pretty close.

Not knowing exactly everything, you've got 2 options in my mind:

1) Cut calories some more. I've seen people have to go as low as 8 calories per pound plus exercise for the weight to come off. It's a bear but so's life.

2) Ramp calories back up to maintenance for a couple of weeks and start from there with a deficit... see if that starts the weight loss again.

 

[SweatPea]

Not knowing exactly everything, you've got 2 options in my mind:

1) Cut calories some more. I've seen people have to go as low as 8 calories per pound plus exercise for the weight to come off. It's a bear but so's life.

2) Ramp calories back up to maintenance for a couple of weeks and start from there with a deficit... see if that starts the weight loss again.

Ok so even calorie cycling wouldn't work for me?

Here is my last few days run down for what I calculated (I think I missed a few days.)

Sept. 2, - 1936
Sept. 3, - 1427
Sept. 4, - 1685
Sept. 5, - 2216
Sept. 6, - 1771
Sept. 7, - 1021
Sept. 9, - 1124
Sept. 10, - 1972
Sept. 11, - 1808
Sept. 12, - 1552

So if I'm 170 lbs and I do 8 cals/lb then I am to consume 1360 cals? or do you mean 8 cals/lb of what my goal weight is?

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Steve]

Ok so even calorie cycling wouldn't work for me?

Here is my last few days run down for what I calculated (I think I missed a few days.)

Sept. 2, - 1936
Sept. 3, - 1427
Sept. 4, - 1685
Sept. 5, - 2216
Sept. 6, - 1771
Sept. 7, - 1021
Sept. 9, - 1124
Sept. 10, - 1972
Sept. 11, - 1808
Sept. 12, - 1552

So if I'm 170 lbs and I do 8 cals/lb then I am to consume 1360 cals? or do you mean 8 cals/lb of what my goal weight is?

Thanks for the advice.

I can't say calorie cycling won't work. You don't know that sort of thing until you try it.

By 8 calories per pound, I mean pound of current weight.

I'd also like to add that I'd recommend getting very consistent with your intake and see what happens.

If you are going to try the route of going down in caloric intake from where you are instead of up to maintenance, start at like 1800 and work your way down from there.

 

[SweatPea]

I can't say calorie cycling won't work. You don't know that sort of thing until you try it.

By 8 calories per pound, I mean pound of current weight.

I'd also like to add that I'd recommend getting very consistent with your intake and see what happens.

If you are going to try the route of going down in caloric intake from where you are instead of up to maintenance, start at like 1800 and work your way down from there.

So just be more consistent with the caloric intake and start at 1800? Ok, I can do that.

Thanks. I'll keep you updated.

 

[lungsfortherace]

Steve,

I have a question about caloric intake for my boyfriend. He is 6'4.5" and weighs a fat 340 (he told me to type that). We decided to change our lives over a month ago. He began at 360, so he's lost 20 pounds. He goes to the gym 6-7 days per week and does 40 minutes of cardio every time he visits the gym and lifts in 3 day on and one day off cycles. He lifts before he does his cardio.

He's been eating 1600 calories per day and he knows from my nagging that this is simply not enough. He doesn't feel hungry and has never felt faint but he is worried about plateauing and scewing up his metabolism, etc.

Aside from working out, he is a student and works a retail job. We put his info into fitday in an effort to come up with a maintenance caloric level for him and it said he should be consuming over 4800 calories if he wanted to continue to be fat. That number did not factor in his training.

He is "real fat." So does this mean he could potentially be consuming 2400 calories per day? You mentioned that you don't have a problem with people who consume 50% maintenance if they are dedicated and "real fat." He would like to average a 2.5 loss per week. Is this realistic? What sort of caloric intake do you recommend?

(He made me type this. I keep telling him he needs to eat at least 2400 calories per day!)

Thanks for your time!

Tamara

 

[Steve]

Steve,

I have a question about caloric intake for my boyfriend. He is 6'4.5" and weighs a fat 340 (he told me to type that). We decided to change our lives over a month ago. He began at 360, so he's lost 20 pounds. He goes to the gym 6-7 days per week and does 40 minutes of cardio every time he visits the gym and lifts in 3 day on and one day off cycles. He lifts before he does his cardio.

He's been eating 1600 calories per day and he knows from my nagging that this is simply not enough. He doesn't feel hungry and has never felt faint but he is worried about plateauing and scewing up his metabolism, etc.

Aside from working out, he is a student and works a retail job. We put his info into fitday in an effort to come up with a maintenance caloric level for him and it said he should be consuming over 4800 calories if he wanted to continue to be fat. That number did not factor in his training.

He is "real fat." So does this mean he could potentially be consuming 2400 calories per day? You mentioned that you don't have a problem with people who consume 50% maintenance if they are dedicated and "real fat." He would like to average a 2.5 loss per week. Is this realistic? What sort of caloric intake do you recommend?

(He made me type this. I keep telling him he needs to eat at least 2400 calories per day!)

Thanks for your time!

Tamara

First, let me say that anyone who wants to ask me questions can always feel free to stop by my journal. You don't need to wait for me to come out of 'hiding.'

Second, your post certainly relates to this topic here. You've got a real big guy. How long has he been eating so few calories? How did he eat to get as big as he is? Why didn't how he ate to get that big "fill" him up?

The weight should be coming off rather quickly at that intake, no?

I wouldn't go below 50% of maintenance. Many conservative trainers, even on this site, would probably disagree with me. But with obese individuals, I've cut food intake by 50% of maintenance without issue, as long as the person can psychologically handle it.

And by that, I mean handle it in the long term. NOT simply a few weeks.

 

[lungsfortherace]

First, let me say that anyone who wants to ask me questions can always feel free to stop by my journal. You don't need to wait for me to come out of 'hiding.'

Second, your post certainly relates to this topic here. You've got a real big guy. How long has he been eating so few calories? How did he eat to get as big as he is? Why didn't how he ate to get that big "fill" him up?

The weight should be coming off rather quickly at that intake, no?

I wouldn't go below 50% of maintenance. Many conservative trainers, even on this site, would probably disagree with me. But with obese individuals, I've cut food intake by 50% of maintenance without issue, as long as the person can psychologically handle it.

And by that, I mean handle it in the long term. NOT simply a few weeks.

He's been eating that way for about 5 weeks. And maybe he's lost more than 20 pounds, as it's been a while since he weighed himself. We think he weighed in last time at 340, but we're unsure because the scale stops at 300 but the needle went around 300 and stopped on 40 (I hope this makes sense.).

How did he eat to get as big as he is? Eating poorly, eating constantly, eating for the wrong reasons, little to no exercise, you name it. Oh, he was "full" but eating way past fullness. He wouldn't consider himself a binger because bingeing implies "eating a lot in spurts." He just ate a lot all the time.

And yes, he's losing weight faster than I am (I started a week or 10 days before he did.), I think, simply because he's bigger than I am and more overweight than I am and he's a dude. Doesn't testosterone help with fat loss?

Anyway, he's pleased and just as dedicated as I am. This is not a diet for either of us, but a lifestyle overhaul. He will continue to count calories even when he reaches goal simply for the sake of training himself to eat properly and maintain instead of either being losing or gaining.

I guess his biggest concern revolves around the fact that he doesn't want to wreck his metabolism by eating half his maintenance.

Thanks again!

Tamara