Protien is good.. just eat less carbs.
Low Carb. Diet question
- Thread starter troutman
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Jeanette401
New member
I suppose in a way it's true - but is it practical? I mean, it's like saying I can eat 5000 calories a day as long as I burn 5000 calories a day. Sure, it's true but how exactly am I supposed to burn that many calories?
Also, that doesn't touch the subject of insulin resistance etc. Some people actually do better with lower carbs. Especially lower simple carbs. Some people don't. Generally the only way to know which you are is to try it out and see. My husband has seen great changes by drastically reducing simple carbs - he also had many of the indicators for insulin resistance.
So whether or not you restrict carbs is pretty much dependent on your circumstances and not some global "Carbs are good! Carbs are teh devil!" determination.
Jericho
New member
Did your husband replace those simple carbs with the same number of calories or could the results come from reduced calories..
Either way, your last statement is pretty on target.
Jeanette401
New member
I imagine he replaced them with fewer - I'm not suggesting a greater thermogenic cost for low carb
However, he HATES counting calories. Won't do it. Has no clue how many calories he eats, ever. He eats when he's hungry. However, since before the change in diet he was borderline needing blood pressure medication, on cholesterol medication, and obviously was hungry enough that he presumably ate more calories in general.And this was with going to the gym 4 days a week doing weights + cardio before he changed his diet.
If he'd just lowered calories, would he have gotten rid of many of the pre-diabetic symptoms? I can't say either way, but I'm pretty sure he'd be hungrier
Jeanette401
New member
I sort of thought a diet was changing what you ate
KitteeChaos
New member
Well I lost 50 pounds doing Atkins and all I did count was the carbs, not calories. I didn't plan my meals or anything. I just ate when I was hungry. It was very easy to me. Usually I would make a burger patty out of ground beef or eat a can of tuna. I don't feel hungry very often while doing low carb diets. To stop myself from having cravings, I eat a spoon of peanut butter everyday. I don't know if that sounds weird but it's a little something to make me feel satisfied without going crazy and binging on junk. It doesn't affect me either. When I lost the 50 pounds, I was staying at or under 20 grams of carbs a day and I lost a pound (just about) either every day or every other day. Maybe some people say it's not healthy or whatever, but I take a vitamin every day and I feel fine and it's the only way that has ever really worked for me to lose weight.
I understand that they work. It is a scientific fact that high protein diets put your body in ketosis. That is when the liver converts fats into fatty acids. (look it up)
"Some clinicians regard ketosis as a crisis reaction of the body due to a lack of carbohydrates in the diet and consider it a dangerous and potentially life-threatening state that stresses the liver and causes destruction of muscle tissues" as per wikipedia.
Dangerous long term stuff man. This is not how we are made and it will cause long term damage. Heck what about atkins? they say he died from falling and hitting his head. He was young too I think about early 70s.
All I am saying is balance. There has to be balance. If we were meant to eat moslty proteins why are there so many fruits and veggies in this world?
Think about it.
Response
Everybody's body is different, that's what you're not considering. Yes there are lots of fruits and vegetables but there are also plants considered poisonous and of course there's tobacco and marijuana but that doesn't mean we should all smoke. Everybody has to find what works for them, and another person can't tell someone what's right for that person unless you're a doctor and you've seen their blood work-up.
Everybody's body is different, that's what you're not considering. Yes there are lots of fruits and vegetables but there are also plants considered poisonous and of course there's tobacco and marijuana but that doesn't mean we should all smoke. Everybody has to find what works for them, and another person can't tell someone what's right for that person unless you're a doctor and you've seen their blood work-up.
Jeanette401
New member
Ok, I'm a little confused about high protein=ketosis. You can get in ketosis by eating high fat, low protein, low carb, because ketosis is about the lack of carbs, not about the presence of protein. Even your own quote points to the lack of carbs as the culprit, even though there have not actually been any studies that indicate long term ketosis is dangerous. So why are you calling it 'high protein'?
Incidentally, if you want to avoid the affects, I've read (which is probably at least as reliable as 'some clinicians regard...' that twice a week you can eat more than 100g of carbs in a day and avoid the effects of ketosis while still getting the benefits of a 'high protein' diet the rest of the time. 100g of carbs is generally the amount needed to keep you out of ketosis - so even if you're eating twice as much protein (200g) you still shouldn't be in this 'potentially life-threatening' state.
And... uh, what does Atkins dying from hitting his head have to do with his diet? I gather he slipped and hit his head. If there's a diet that prevents that, I'd like to be on it! (The fat head diet gives plenty of cushion?)
Incidentally, if you want to avoid the affects, I've read (which is probably at least as reliable as 'some clinicians regard...' that twice a week you can eat more than 100g of carbs in a day and avoid the effects of ketosis while still getting the benefits of a 'high protein' diet the rest of the time. 100g of carbs is generally the amount needed to keep you out of ketosis - so even if you're eating twice as much protein (200g) you still shouldn't be in this 'potentially life-threatening' state.
And... uh, what does Atkins dying from hitting his head have to do with his diet? I gather he slipped and hit his head. If there's a diet that prevents that, I'd like to be on it! (The fat head diet gives plenty of cushion?
)Carbs
Well, yeah, you are trying to tell someone what to do -the fact is that all of us have different metabolisms, and a low-carb diet does NOT mean high protein or high fat. Everyone should NOT eat the same thing, our bodies simply process things differently. And, when you eat lots of vegetables, you ARE getting carbs - you're just not getting truck loads of them. Every body is different and we all have to find what works for us, short- and long-term.
Well, yeah, you are trying to tell someone what to do -the fact is that all of us have different metabolisms, and a low-carb diet does NOT mean high protein or high fat. Everyone should NOT eat the same thing, our bodies simply process things differently. And, when you eat lots of vegetables, you ARE getting carbs - you're just not getting truck loads of them. Every body is different and we all have to find what works for us, short- and long-term.
So Lola what you're saying is you should eat vegetables? Because if you do then you are not on a high protein diet. You are on a somewhat balanced diet which is what I am saying. Plans like Atkins tell you to eat much more protein then carbs. I'm sorry but that's not a good thing. And we are all very similar in how we metabolize foods.
Any diet that says have too much of one thing is a fad diet and not healthy long term. If everyone ate balanced meaning some starchy carbs, some protein, some healthy fats and some complex carbs and ate more times daily but proportioned to their weight and size they would see a difference in their body's ability (metabolism) to burn calories.
I will agree with you that some people would need more carbs than protein or more protein than carbs but not completely skewed in one direction or another.
100 grams of carbs is 400 calories. That is not nearly enough to sustain a healthy body.
It is a fact that complex carbs such as grains, oats fruits & vegetables contain the proper nutrition we need such as vitamins, minerals, fiber and antioxidants. Proteins dont supply us with that like carbs do.
And I am telling people what to do as much as you and the next person is. I am stating my opinion based on what I have studied and learned. I have seen balanced diets work long term for people always but have seen high protein diets work short term only to have people go back to their old ways.
Teaching people how to eat is the answer "in my opinion" rather than showing them how to eat on a diet.
But I do respect your opinion as well. So I hope you would respect mine.
Any diet that says have too much of one thing is a fad diet and not healthy long term. If everyone ate balanced meaning some starchy carbs, some protein, some healthy fats and some complex carbs and ate more times daily but proportioned to their weight and size they would see a difference in their body's ability (metabolism) to burn calories.
I will agree with you that some people would need more carbs than protein or more protein than carbs but not completely skewed in one direction or another.
100 grams of carbs is 400 calories. That is not nearly enough to sustain a healthy body.
It is a fact that complex carbs such as grains, oats fruits & vegetables contain the proper nutrition we need such as vitamins, minerals, fiber and antioxidants. Proteins dont supply us with that like carbs do.
And I am telling people what to do as much as you and the next person is. I am stating my opinion based on what I have studied and learned. I have seen balanced diets work long term for people always but have seen high protein diets work short term only to have people go back to their old ways.
Teaching people how to eat is the answer "in my opinion" rather than showing them how to eat on a diet.
But I do respect your opinion as well. So I hope you would respect mine.
Jeanette ketosis is ketosis whether it is from fats or proteins. All I am saying is we should eat more carbohydrates than protein. Or at least close to equal shares of each. That includes starchy carbs too. Did you hear the latest that the starch in potatoes actually burns belly fat? Who"d have thought? All these years they say don't eat potatoes it is too high on the glycemic scale and than they find out they are good for you. Why? Because they are a vegetable. The resistant starch in a potato burns belly fat! I did not make that up by the way just did the research on it.
Look don't get me wrong I eat plenty of meat and fish and nuts etc.. and I believe in protein as a vital part of health and weight loss. Our cells are made of protein so obviously we need it.
All I have been saying this whole time is a diet like Atkins is unhealthy long term and you should eat balanced. How long has the Atkins diet been around? 10-12 years? how do they know that it is ok to eat like that? No one does but without a good amount of fruits and vegetables you will most likely get arteriosclerosis, colon cancer, stroke etc.. because you are not getting the amount of soluble and insoluble fiber you should daily. 25 to 30 grams.
As far as Atkins I said that because I personally believe he died of a brain hemorrhage or something due to eating a lack of healthy carbs. Just my opinion. I fave no facts or supporting evidence on that.
Ed
Look don't get me wrong I eat plenty of meat and fish and nuts etc.. and I believe in protein as a vital part of health and weight loss. Our cells are made of protein so obviously we need it.
All I have been saying this whole time is a diet like Atkins is unhealthy long term and you should eat balanced. How long has the Atkins diet been around? 10-12 years? how do they know that it is ok to eat like that? No one does but without a good amount of fruits and vegetables you will most likely get arteriosclerosis, colon cancer, stroke etc.. because you are not getting the amount of soluble and insoluble fiber you should daily. 25 to 30 grams.
As far as Atkins I said that because I personally believe he died of a brain hemorrhage or something due to eating a lack of healthy carbs. Just my opinion. I fave no facts or supporting evidence on that.
Ed
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Jeanette401
New member
Well, you said 'it is a scientific fact that high protein puts your body in ketosis'. I'm not sure what definition for high protein you use, but if it's more protein than carbs, that's not necessarily the case. Eat 120g of protein and 100g of carbs and you won't be in ketosis. That's what I was pointing out. That and I'm not a big fan of scare tactics without something to back it up. We don't know if ketosis is harmful - so to be on the safe side, every couple days eating over 100g of carbs is probably a better safe than sorry kind of bet. But you don't have to eat carbs all the time or it's the end of the world. Nor is Atkins death really a good indication of anything scientifically.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge proponent of the Atkins diet but I do think it's possible to be on the plan and eat lots of fiber and vegetables if you try. And I don't think it's particularly less healthy than being at a BMI of 50.
Could you go into more details on the resistant potato starch? The only study I could find on it involved feeding pigs gelitinized starch in high quantities and not actually whole potatoes. ( )
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge proponent of the Atkins diet but I do think it's possible to be on the plan and eat lots of fiber and vegetables if you try. And I don't think it's particularly less healthy than being at a BMI of 50.
Could you go into more details on the resistant potato starch? The only study I could find on it involved feeding pigs gelitinized starch in high quantities and not actually whole potatoes. ( )
shawnnam
New member
My dietician told me if u dont feed ur body carbs every four hours then it stops ur metabolism and starts digesting muscles or something...does atkins and south beach still give u carbs? if so what kind?
South Beach is not low carb or low fat, it is finding a balance, atkins is low carb and an illogical plan. On SBD you cannot eat carbs, other than vegetables for the first 2 weeks, the idea is that it will fix the chemistry in your body and help you burn fat and cut cravings, after the first 2 weeks you reintroduce-slowly- carbs like fruit and whole grains back into your diet. The idea is that for the rest of your life you avoid eating carbs that are high on the GI (glycemic index) scale like white rice, white bread, basically refined crap.
That sounds like a solid eating plan. Once you get some weight loss in from minimizing the carbs then you can reintroduce them in as a part of a balanced diet. I do understand some people lose more weight by eating more carbs then protein and vice versa but as you said balance is key. Cutting out carbs or reducing them to too low of an amount is not good in my opinion. Atkins is not a healthy way to go though. Too much fat and not enough vitamins and fiber.
Low carb diets do work, but they are just too samey. You know, meat, eggs and high fat cheese (0.1g carbs per 100g cheese). All veg have carbs in different amounts so you are stuck with spinach and mushrooms. And forget fruit as sugar = carbs. For the first month you can only have 20g carbs a day. The first week is ok, after that it gets boring.
Low carb is expensive and unhealthy, not to mention you get really cranky and headachey. Just think of all that stearic acid, cholesterol etc. The only good thing about this is cutting out refined foods (bread/pasta/rice/sugar/ cakes/cookies)
I did this yrs ago and since then became vegetarian - THE IRONY!!! Doing low carbs will leave you craving fruit and veg.
Low carb is expensive and unhealthy, not to mention you get really cranky and headachey. Just think of all that stearic acid, cholesterol etc. The only good thing about this is cutting out refined foods (bread/pasta/rice/sugar/ cakes/cookies)
I did this yrs ago and since then became vegetarian - THE IRONY!!! Doing low carbs will leave you craving fruit and veg.
ahoeinoirntopo
Banned
I started by being on under 30 grams of carbs per day, for 2 weeks. At first I had some minor headaches/fatigue, but all that wore off and now I have more energy and dont feel that mental fog I used to get on the 'itis' life - high carbs. I honestly believe that human body does not need a single gram of carbohydrates in order to survive/live. Its just something we've started doing in last hundred years, from growing fruits and vegetables to refined sugars and rice and all the baking stuff. I reintroduced small amounts of carbs mostly from 1-2 apples/oranges/apricots and tomatoes/vegetables. But I keep high fat lifestyle now.
Fat is extremely important, as it is the building block of your cell walls and hormones. Dietary fat also can't be converted into glucose, so you won't get insulin spike which will deposit fats. I keep under 100 grams of proteins per day and under 30 grams of carbs, and I don't really count the calories, not that I've been eating a lot or anything. So far almost 20 pounds lost in a month without any exercise, and no I did not lose any muscle. I was actually lifting weights last few days and don't feel any loss of strength at all.
Fat is extremely important, as it is the building block of your cell walls and hormones. Dietary fat also can't be converted into glucose, so you won't get insulin spike which will deposit fats. I keep under 100 grams of proteins per day and under 30 grams of carbs, and I don't really count the calories, not that I've been eating a lot or anything. So far almost 20 pounds lost in a month without any exercise, and no I did not lose any muscle. I was actually lifting weights last few days and don't feel any loss of strength at all.