Journey, Not A Destination

If you hit deficits of 2000 consistently without losing weight at all, you aren't really in that much of a deficit.

I mean, you'd think you are.

But b/c of the dynamics of what the human metabolism is, changes have occured that make what should be a deficit a maintenance. It's a bitch like that.

You've hit on the crux of the problem. Not only is it difficult for me to achieve that 2000 calorie deficit, but it does absolutely nothing. The f'd up part is that I also maintain my weight without that deficit. So how do I get out of this? How can I achieve a larger deficit when I'm always hungry?! LOL This sucks..

I'm just like you. I battle hunger all the time when I diet.

Have you thought about adding more meals; breaking up your cals a bit more?

I eat plenty when I'm not at work, sometimes every 2 hours or grazing all day long. Other days I manage to achieve a deficit by not doing that, usually when I'm working downtown. So I wouldn't even manage much of a deficit if I added more meals on my low/work days.

How many grams of protein and fat are you eating?

I tend to eat between 90 and 130 grams of protein and my fat intake is always high (which is probably not great), usually upwards of 48% of my diet. Unfortunately I am very bad with sticking to any specific plans which involve too much detail or inflexibility for very long. What makes it hard is that my days do not follow the same plan every day (my work schedule is somewhat varied and some days I'm a home body and some times I'm out running around crazy busy).

I'm honestly feeling like nothing is going to work anymore and that I should be satisified with this weight, but the bottom line is that I know I can eat the same amount, and exercise the same, and easily be able to maintain a 10 lb lower weight, so that's what spurs me on. If I can just get rid of this weight I can do the same thing and be happier with my weight. Any doable suggestions would be appreciated.

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh :rolleyes:
 
I tend to eat between 90 and 130 grams of protein and my fat intake is always high (which is probably not great), usually upwards of 48% of my diet. Unfortunately I am very bad with sticking to any specific plans which involve too much detail or inflexibility for very long. What makes it hard is that my days do not follow the same plan every day (my work schedule is somewhat varied and some days I'm a home body and some times I'm out running around crazy busy).

I'm honestly feeling like nothing is going to work anymore and that I should be satisified with this weight, but the bottom line is that I know I can eat the same amount, and exercise the same, and easily be able to maintain a 10 lb lower weight, so that's what spurs me on. If I can just get rid of this weight I can do the same thing and be happier with my weight. Any doable suggestions would be appreciated.

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh :rolleyes:

And sounds like you like flexibility.

However, to reach another level of leanness, you might need a more structured approach. Some sort of cyclical calorie/carb approach may be required.

Once our bodies reach its setpoint, it can pretty much refuse to give any more weight up. Create a deficit and bam, it downregulates relatively quickly to create a new lower deficit. Start eating more and it upregulates to give you a new higher maintenance. Sounds like where you are at.

To beat that, you need to fake it out.

And a cyclical approach is one such way of doing that. Make it believe it's well fed than hit it with a big deficit. Then ramp cals back up a bit. There are many iterations of such an approach and certainly no one right way of going about it.

Have I asked you how many calories you are consuming per day? I hate when I get into a post and am too lazy to open another browser to read your above posts. If not, how many are you eating?

You don't see me speak to a lot of relatively lean folk on this forum. Giving advice to people carrying a lot of excess fat is easy. But when you get down to where you are, the waters can muddy quite easily and quickly.

Let me speak some generalities wrt to dieting the fat off from an already lean (relatively speaking) state:

The essentials of it are that thermodynamics rules above all else. This means that once energy balance is negative, you're dropping body mass. The problem is, the leaner you are, the more dynamic your metabolism becomes. It adjusts a lot quicker, as noted above.

The idea is to shed some fat and maintain your muscle. And that's what's difficult at this stage in the game. A fatty can drop fat without worrying about a large drop in muscle quite easily. Just check out some of the transformations on biggest loser. They lose hundreds of pounds and are left with a nice muscular base.

The only real way around muscle loss is with training heavy with limited volume, as this sends a strong signal to retain muscle. Diet is another matter...you jack up protein intake to support both protein turnover in the body (dietary protein will be used for aminos before muscle) and for energy needs. Your protein is probably a bit low.

Fats, you need a certain amount of essentials. Preferences are monounsaturated and certain polyunsaturateds. Olive oil, fish oil, flax, borage, things of that nature. These will help with hormone profiles as well as certain aspects of partitioning (the P-ratio).

I like the cyclical part of it to come in with carbs. Many experts, and I agree, like to incorporate periodic refeedings, which are intervals of eating in an energy surplus, as opposed to a deficit. These refeeds provided the content and duration is proper (generally lots of carbs, and 12-24 hours in length on average) will reset leptin, which is your body's systemic regulator of energy intake.

Other than that, you can do things like emphasizing anaerobic endurance with things like HIIT which tends to be muscle sparing and fat-oxidizing to gain a further edge on your partitioning.

That's it in a nutshell.

You can see where you stack up against that and make some improvements. Let me check to see if you mentioned how many calories you are consuming above.
 
Steve, I so much appreciate your reply. At this point I really need some specific help as I'm really spinning my wheels here.

Here are my calories for the few weeks before last week (when I went away and didn't count but didn't gain either); this is fairly typical of what I've been doing all summer, except I've had periods of no deficits/just maintenance as well:

1409
2026
1740
1437
1820
2011
1415
2577
2803
1236
1402
1897
2350
1581
2131
2137
1600

So you can see I follow this extreme deficit/refeed approach. Even this doesn't seem to work for me!!! My RMR test said my maintenance (including lifestyle activities but not exercise) is between 1900-2000 calories. Anything specific you'd recommend based on this?

I appreciate your time :).
 
And sounds like you like flexibility.


A fatty can drop fat without worrying about a large drop in muscle quite easily. Just check out some of the transformations on biggest loser. They lose hundreds of pounds and are left with a nice muscular base.

Ooh you used the "fatty" word. Did you pick up that language from Balldez??? JK!!
Seriously that guy was a jerk, and I missed it all until just now!
 
So you are jumping all over the place with your intake now which should be enough to keep your body guessing.

That said though, I've seen people who have to do daily cardio and drop to 8 calories per pound. You are nowhere near that.

You might, even though I know how much of a bear hunger can be, want to try 3 day deficit, 1-2 day maintenance/surplus approach. And toy around with your deficit a bit.

You caloric intake should be structured around your training.

Or, something like if you are lifting weights on MWF, high/medium days should fall on these days.

Days with no or low intensity exercise should be your low days.

And your low isn't low based on these numbers you've given me.

Suppose you are 140 lbs.

A moderate number for weight loss would be 1400 cals. You were at or below this number around 30% of the time. That right there is most likely your problem

An aggressive number for weight loss, still assuming 140 lbs, would be 1100 calories.

So, the idea is to set up a structured way of eating where there are high/med calorie days, yet, an overall more consistent deficit.

See what I'm saying?
 
Good almost afternoon, Steve. :) I see you're helping our girl, Blancita. She and I have been struggling with our plateaus together, so I know she can use your expertise. :beerchug:
 
Blancita, Not to jump into Steve's thread (oops I guess I already did that), but have you had your body fat analyzed? Like with those calipers or at a gym?

Just curious. Because I'm wondering if you are just at a good weight and since you do work out quite a bit, maybe you are toned enough and shouldn't worry so much about what the scale says?

Are you measuring yourself too?

I'm sure all these questions have been answered somewhere. Just curious since I've been following the Q & A.
 
Yes. Mal booted him and his alter ego the chef when he tried to sign up 20min after balldez was banned. Good ole Mal...:beerchug:

That's hilarious.

I know there are a ton of people like that on the web.

I just wonder how they act in the real world.
 
That said though, I've seen people who have to do daily cardio and drop to 8 calories per pound. You are nowhere near that.

Yup, that hasn't been done cuz I just cant manage it. 2 days at below 1800 and I'm refeeding like crazy. I feel so depleted its crazy!

You might, even though I know how much of a bear hunger can be, want to try 3 day deficit, 1-2 day maintenance/surplus approach. And toy around with your deficit a bit.

So you're saying try to manage 3 days per week at 1400, and 2 to 3 at 1800 and 2000? Something like that?

You caloric intake should be structured around your training.

Or, something like if you are lifting weights on MWF, high/medium days should fall on these days.

Days with no or low intensity exercise should be your low days.

Only sucky part is that my appetite increases when I'm not working at the office; and I only find time for the gym on days when I'm going to the office; I have an elliptical at home or do a 3 to 4 mile walk when not at the office, but of course my appetite increases like crazy. I need to TRY HARDER OBVIOUSLY (note to self).

And your low isn't low based on these numbers you've given me.

Suppose you are 140 lbs You're close!.

A moderate number for weight loss would be 1400 cals. You were at or below this number around 30% of the time. That right there is most likely your problem

An aggressive number for weight loss, still assuming 140 lbs, would be 1100 calories. Oooh boy, I'd be starving and I'm not kidding. And I get very nasty and physically aggressive when starving (e.g. elbowing people and mouthing off when I get pushed on the subway, getting very short fuzed with H, etc)

So, the idea is to set up a structured way of eating where there are high/med calorie days, yet, an overall more consistent deficit. I suppose I must try harder not to go overboard on my refeed days when I'm just starving from a few low days, and also try to manage to hit those low days of 1400 despite the fact that I'm starving and weak from hunger.

See what I'm saying?

Thanks a lot!
 
It's really just a matter of will and how bad you want it. If it's not worth it, don't do it. Or start subtely.

Cut back on your high days and get more low days in there. By low I mean 1400 or less.

I hate to be so blunt.... but that's pretty much that.

What's your exact exercise routine?
 
Blancita, Not to jump into Steve's thread (oops I guess I already did that), but have you had your body fat analyzed? Like with those calipers or at a gym?

Just curious. Because I'm wondering if you are just at a good weight and since you do work out quite a bit, maybe you are toned enough and shouldn't worry so much about what the scale says?

Are you measuring yourself too?

I'm sure all these questions have been answered somewhere. Just curious since I've been following the Q & A.

Hey SweatPea (I like the sweat versus sweet :)), I definitely have a bit of body fat to come off. I'm only 5'1.5" (I usually round up to 5'2") and I'm fairly toned/muscular but definitely have plenty of flab that needs going. My waist is 31" and I want that paired down a lot! I could care less about any other area frankly, just want my waist and stomach tiny. I know I look good at my goal weight because its my normal weight (until a few years ago) and trust me, a shorty like me still has plenty of curves at 128 lbs (I've never aspired to the thin look).
 
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