?? I don't follow.
And if you fuel this with the right amount of food, you still think it is damaging to your organs?
Show me some research. I am more a fan of hard science than opinions.
Does Anyone Here Know the Average Lean Weight of People in General Across the World?
- Thread starter bjhealth
- Start date
?? I don't follow.
And if you fuel this with the right amount of food, you still think it is damaging to your organs?
Show me some research. I am more a fan of hard science than opinions.
The extra fuel is one of the factors I've considered. Your body needs to detoxify the metabolites from the food and digestion. For example: when amino acids are “burned” as fuel, ammonia (NH3) is a waste product.
Even if you eat the highest quality food, you will have to eliminate waste.
I need the facts too but some hardheads won't even consider research.
I understand how we catabolize the various macronutrients. And I have seen "reports" that eating less food is better than eating more food. However, I have yet to see a study that involves eating more food and living the lifestyle of say, me. I eat perfectly 99% of the time. Perfect in the sense that my diet is mostly natural, full of heart healthy components, very little saturated fats. The "reports" that I mention above usually compare someone leading a somewhat healthy lifestyle of controlled calories compared to someone eating like shit. Well no crap, A is going to be better off than B.
KWIM?
Are we saying that just b/c my organs have to work more, not necessarily harder, to catabolize, digest, utilize, and/or remove nutrients, that I will somehow die prematurely? My organs will reach a point, even though they are extremely healthy, where my body outlives my organs b/c they have been over-used?
I just have a hard time buying that concept, if this is what you are questioning. I don't think you are proposing it. But you want to know the facts. I just don't think they exist as of now.
I bet you would get some interesting responses over at lyle mcdonalds board found at . You might also get some harsh answers, but if you have thick skin, it might be worth your time.
Well, I don't really have the research available but your whole body could easily suffer from fatigue and there's no telling what could go wrong from over-training or from the nutritional aspects of bodybuilding.
One problem is that people have the belief that huge muscles are healthy pounded into them from day one. Most people can not accept the possibility that it might not be so they wouldn't even consider researching the matter. Besides, it's a multi-billion dollar industry. Such research wouldn't be good for business.
One problem is that people have the belief that huge muscles are healthy pounded into them from day one. Most people can not accept the possibility that it might not be so they wouldn't even consider researching the matter. Besides, it's a multi-billion dollar industry. Such research wouldn't be good for business.
Oh come on now.... now you are just being absurd. If you want to try and figure something out scientifically, and especially physiologically, don't bring a million different variables into play.... it will only leave you clueless as to what the truth really is.
If you think that hypercaloric eating chronically can lead to some kind of "organ drain" that could lead to premature death.... OK.
But as soon as you brought overtraining into the picture, that just turned me off of the discussion. Why?
1. You could play the "what if" game using 3.7 trillion variables. That is not fun to me. It is like saying, hmmm, should I drive to work today. I better not, I could crash it. But if I walk, i might trip on the curb and hit my head. Ahhh, I better stay home. Wait, if I do that, the roof could fall on me. See what I am saying? Focus on one thing at a time.
2. I really don't think overtraining is deadly. Counter-productive? Certainly. Deadly, I highly doubt it.
3. I am assuming we are talking about lifters or bodybuilders whom actually know what the F*&$ they are doing in the gym. Obviously managing neural fatigue is one of the most basic and important concepts when it comes to training and periodization.
Haha, and I don't think anyone with half a brain thinks muscle are healthy. Most people who have muscles and obtain them naturally through PROPER exercise and dieting, generally are more healthy than a vast majority of the population. I don't quite see your point here.
But I interested in the conversation.
CaseyAtMartin
New member
How would muscles increase fatigue? If anything, they'd help your body become more efficient with the energy you have. If you have large muscles, you obviously are eating the caloric surplus it requires to build and maintain them.
Not really anything scientific in here, but I thought I'd just throw my two cents in.
"People won't do the research" isn't really a good defense for the argument.
Not really anything scientific in here, but I thought I'd just throw my two cents in.
"People won't do the research" isn't really a good defense for the argument.
You have become less and less coherent throughout this discussion that you have twisted into an argument. You are rude and you need to watch how you speak. This is a public forum not a "locker room." Forgive the pun.
Now in answer to your barely coherent statements:
1) If you ignore variables, you are not practicing science you are just plain stupid.
2) People end up in the hospital from overtraining, SRIs and mental illness associated with bodybuilding. It can be deadly. You've spoken yourself about drugs and steroids. People turn to them because of fatigue among other reasons.
3)We were talking about people in general and "average lean weight" and we went off on the tangent of muscle building and possible dangers.
I don't know what you mean when you say that you don't think people with half a brain think muscles are healthy. Sterotypically, muscle heads are thought of as extraordinarily healthy but not real bright. (some say that BBs are airheads due to a reaction of tryptophan because it is not used for building muscles and some other aminos that would normally balance out in the brain are in short supply because their muscles utlilized them)
I'm sure that most people who live a lifestyle centered on nutrition and exercise are more likely to be healthy, remain healthy and live a long time.
I never had a point. I only posed a question out of curiosity.
Everything a person needs to do to develop and maintain a large muscular physique will cause fatigue. A bodybuilder's lifestyle requires perserverance. It is a major reason why people turn to drugs and steroids. At the same time exercise and healthy eating will also help to increase energy levels. You need to find the program. You need to find balance.
freshman15
New member
haha I'm just flipping through and if that's really your picture you're overweight by BMI standards because you're ripped! Keep it up good looking
CaseyAtMartin
New member
I don't really understand what you're saying here.
Sorry, looks like I left out a word or two. You need to find the right fitness program to avoid fatigue. A balanced routine tailor fitted to your life would be the best.
Bodybuilding is definitely not an easy life. But if you are perseverant or lucky, you could find it rewarding. I just don't know if it is healthy.
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sirant
New member
Heres an interesting stat...
North Americans and westerners in general are gaining a reputaion very quickly in the world as being an overweight culture. And its really quite correct, considering the staggeringly high percentages of overweight and obese westerners compared to fit ones. I believe North America has now passed the 65% overweight mark, and obesity is soon going to become a bigger premature killer than smoking, drugs, car accidents and violence combined. (In another 3 years England will hit 70%!) Asian countries are not experiencing this phenomenon yet (and I say yet because in their ever increasing desire to westernize they are also getting bigger and bigger. The obesity rate for children in China grows at 8% per year!! Not overweight, OBESE!! What a shockingly high number....)
But overall, asians are skinnier than westerners. Here is an interesting statistic that may have a lot to do with that.
Average Walking Distance
The Average person in Asia walks 10km+ every single day. They dont all go running to the gyms, eat low carb or low fat, or joine weight loss support groups. But they do walk everywhere.
The Average person in North America walks LESS than 1km a day (usually from house to car, car to office and reverse back home)
What a staggering number. And though most of us here I would never consider average, since we are all actively trying to change our own lives, I am sure we all know those people that drive 2 blocks to the 7-Eleven and would rather pay huge parking fees each month than walk those 2 km to work.
I know from my own experience that I would have shuddered at the thought of walking 1 km to work a few years ago and would have found every excuse in the book not to. Now I am walking during my lunch and after work for 8-10km every single day. And I have never in my life felt better.... Go figure.
Sorry, not BMI or such stats like that, that I know of anyways. But I thought you might find this one interesting.
sirant
North Americans and westerners in general are gaining a reputaion very quickly in the world as being an overweight culture. And its really quite correct, considering the staggeringly high percentages of overweight and obese westerners compared to fit ones. I believe North America has now passed the 65% overweight mark, and obesity is soon going to become a bigger premature killer than smoking, drugs, car accidents and violence combined. (In another 3 years England will hit 70%!) Asian countries are not experiencing this phenomenon yet (and I say yet because in their ever increasing desire to westernize they are also getting bigger and bigger. The obesity rate for children in China grows at 8% per year!! Not overweight, OBESE!! What a shockingly high number....)
But overall, asians are skinnier than westerners. Here is an interesting statistic that may have a lot to do with that.
Average Walking Distance
The Average person in Asia walks 10km+ every single day. They dont all go running to the gyms, eat low carb or low fat, or joine weight loss support groups.
But they do walk everywhere.The Average person in North America walks LESS than 1km a day (usually from house to car, car to office and reverse back home)
What a staggering number. And though most of us here I would never consider average, since we are all actively trying to change our own lives, I am sure we all know those people that drive 2 blocks to the 7-Eleven and would rather pay huge parking fees each month than walk those 2 km to work.
I know from my own experience that I would have shuddered at the thought of walking 1 km to work a few years ago and would have found every excuse in the book not to. Now I am walking during my lunch and after work for 8-10km every single day. And I have never in my life felt better.... Go figure.
Sorry, not BMI or such stats like that, that I know of anyways. But I thought you might find this one interesting.
sirant
OK, you want to play, I'll play.
For future reference, I highly suggest not getting so emotionally attached to a discussion/debate. I am discussing/debating (whatever the feck you want to call it) the topic at hand. There is no reason to get personal or assume I am fighting with you as a person. It is about the topic. Not you. I hate the fact that I have to spell this out, but you have made it blatantly obvious that it is necessary. So please, learn to debate without getting your panties all in a bunch.
I probably wouldn't dignify your pointless posts on any other given day, but I am bored, so again, let's play.
I suggest you do a search for my posts on this forum. I can give you a few other forums to search my name on as well. Aside from friendly banter, you will find that there is nothing incoherent about my speech. It is rather amusing actually, for you to say so though.
Are you serious? You do realize how scientific studies work, right? I never said variables should be ignored. Come on friend, you need to step up your wit if this is how you are going to approach this debate. Putting words in my mouth will get you absolutely nowhere. Obviously all variables should be considered. But in the moment of testing, holding all but one, two at the most, variable constant is required in order to understand cause and effects. If you let everything come into play, there is no way to determine which variables caused which effects.
Do you have any idea how often someone can cause enough neural fatigue to hospitalize themselves? I mean seriously. Such a rare occasion and you are using it as your side of a debate about "too much muscle" being harmful. Such a weak variable you are using, but so be it. Sometimes reaching is all you got!
Just leave drugs out of the picture for now. Obviously drugs bring an unhealthy element into the equation. We are discussing natural athletes now. Natural lifters doing everything healthy besides eating maybe too much (as you might say) and carrying around too much weight (as you might say too). Am I right? That is what you are wondering? Can eating too much of the right things or carrying too much LBM cause harm? All this back and forth debate has left me wondering if this is still what you are interested in.
And your point is?
We were having a civil discussion. About health in general as it applies to the different populations of physiques.
Let me remind you that YOU brought up muscle mass and its role in "general health."
1. The age where muscle heads were thought of as "healthy but not real bright" has come and gone my friend. Come up to the 21st century where there are an endless supply of functionally strong, muscular men and women roaming the globe teaching people how to apply strength training to the average person's life in order to improve general health. I am honored to be part of such a fine group of people. Sorry, but I can’t believe I have to explain myself. But I guess I am fortunate in the fact that I am not surrounded by idiots in my life who assume muscles = lack of brain. And if this is the case for you, which it seems to be, I feel sorry for you.
2. Regarding your comments about tryptophan, give me a break. For those reading this that may not know about this:
Tryptophan is converted to serotonin in the brain, which makes you sleepy. Transport across the brain is limited by competition with large neutral amino acids, like leucine, isoleucine, valine, phenylalanine etc. Bbrs typically take excessive amounts of protein to start with, so an imbalance in amino acids towards tryp is rather unlikely.
Man, you like to bring up such minutia. I don't understand how you figure anything out. Thank the sweet Lord the lovely scientists don't let their rational brains get the best of them like you. We would never figure anything out!
Isn’t this what I have been saying all along? I don’t get it.
What sucks is, these internet quarrels never get anywhere. You are going to pick apart this, I am sure. And I will probably pick apart your next reply. Hopefully you can handle it like an adult, which is yet to be seen. If you can't, then there is no point in continuing this. If you can, great, let's have some fun.
For future reference, I highly suggest not getting so emotionally attached to a discussion/debate. I am discussing/debating (whatever the feck you want to call it) the topic at hand. There is no reason to get personal or assume I am fighting with you as a person. It is about the topic. Not you. I hate the fact that I have to spell this out, but you have made it blatantly obvious that it is necessary. So please, learn to debate without getting your panties all in a bunch.
I probably wouldn't dignify your pointless posts on any other given day, but I am bored, so again, let's play.
I suggest you do a search for my posts on this forum. I can give you a few other forums to search my name on as well. Aside from friendly banter, you will find that there is nothing incoherent about my speech. It is rather amusing actually, for you to say so though.
Are you serious? You do realize how scientific studies work, right? I never said variables should be ignored. Come on friend, you need to step up your wit if this is how you are going to approach this debate. Putting words in my mouth will get you absolutely nowhere. Obviously all variables should be considered. But in the moment of testing, holding all but one, two at the most, variable constant is required in order to understand cause and effects. If you let everything come into play, there is no way to determine which variables caused which effects.
Do you have any idea how often someone can cause enough neural fatigue to hospitalize themselves? I mean seriously. Such a rare occasion and you are using it as your side of a debate about "too much muscle" being harmful. Such a weak variable you are using, but so be it. Sometimes reaching is all you got!
Just leave drugs out of the picture for now. Obviously drugs bring an unhealthy element into the equation. We are discussing natural athletes now. Natural lifters doing everything healthy besides eating maybe too much (as you might say) and carrying around too much weight (as you might say too). Am I right? That is what you are wondering? Can eating too much of the right things or carrying too much LBM cause harm? All this back and forth debate has left me wondering if this is still what you are interested in.
And your point is?
We were having a civil discussion. About health in general as it applies to the different populations of physiques.
Let me remind you that YOU brought up muscle mass and its role in "general health."
1. The age where muscle heads were thought of as "healthy but not real bright" has come and gone my friend. Come up to the 21st century where there are an endless supply of functionally strong, muscular men and women roaming the globe teaching people how to apply strength training to the average person's life in order to improve general health. I am honored to be part of such a fine group of people. Sorry, but I can’t believe I have to explain myself. But I guess I am fortunate in the fact that I am not surrounded by idiots in my life who assume muscles = lack of brain. And if this is the case for you, which it seems to be, I feel sorry for you.
2. Regarding your comments about tryptophan, give me a break. For those reading this that may not know about this:
Tryptophan is converted to serotonin in the brain, which makes you sleepy. Transport across the brain is limited by competition with large neutral amino acids, like leucine, isoleucine, valine, phenylalanine etc. Bbrs typically take excessive amounts of protein to start with, so an imbalance in amino acids towards tryp is rather unlikely.
Man, you like to bring up such minutia. I don't understand how you figure anything out. Thank the sweet Lord the lovely scientists don't let their rational brains get the best of them like you. We would never figure anything out!
Isn’t this what I have been saying all along? I don’t get it.
What sucks is, these internet quarrels never get anywhere. You are going to pick apart this, I am sure. And I will probably pick apart your next reply. Hopefully you can handle it like an adult, which is yet to be seen. If you can't, then there is no point in continuing this. If you can, great, let's have some fun.
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haha I'm just flipping through and if that's really your picture you're overweight by BMI standards because you're ripped! Keep it up good looking
Yes, that is me in the picture. Thanks.
And this is why BMI is a flawed indicator in some situations. But in average, it does to a decent job at predicting health related issues due to size.
My beef is most insurance carriers base your "insurability" off of BMI. In my case, that is ridiculous.
I think you are mentally unbalanced. I will not put up with your cussing, your insults or your harassment. If you proceed with your tirade, you might get yourself suspended from the forum. You have turned this into a brawl. I'm not a fighter.
Most of your comments are irrational. It's like you don't even remember the title of this post and haven't bothered to browse back and review the post. I'm not going to reply in any further detail to you unless you take a few deep breaths.
Stop ranting and let people have a chance to speak about the original topic which was about global body fat statistics?
Calm down.
That was a sensible post. Good job.
And I highly doubt that I will be suspended. Keep reporting my posts though.
Best to you!
