Body Fat / Lean Mass concerns

[zkay]

Hello All

I'm a 20 year old male, standing 5'9 and currently weighing in at 184lbs. When I started on march 5th I weighed in at 218lbs. I've generally lost about 2-2.5 pounds per week, although the very first week I lost about 6-7 pounds, and there were a few weeks where I lost anywhere from 3-5 pounds.

My concern is basically whether or not I've managed to lose any lean mass. I'm stronger than I've ever been, due to lifting kettlebells for strength 3 days a week and doing cardio with them the other 3 days, resting on sunday. I'm sure I could buy a body fat scale or calipers but I'm trying to do this without spending any money.

Any help is appreciated.

-joe

 

[zkay]

Oh, I should mention that there were weeks where I lost little to no weight, followed by weeks where I lost significant amounts of weight. I keep track of my weight every sunday on a piece of paper on my bedroom wall. It goes as follows:

218->211->211(again)->208->206->204->199->197.5->194->191.5->190->188->186

I should also say that if anything I'm getting stronger; at the outset I could hardly lift my 35lb to do 25-30 presses. Now I can do upwards of 150-200 combined with the 35lb, and can generally do about 10-12 combined with my 53lb.

-joe

 

[maleficent]

you're losing fat.
I assume your measurements have changed, and your clothes are fitting better.
you're looking better
you're feeling stronger and are stronger

body fat scales are notoriously inaccurate -the only thing they'll give you is another number to compare againsy.

Iwouldn't be too concerned with loss of lean body mass with all the positives that you've got going..

 

[zkay]

you're losing fat.
I assume your measurements have changed, and your clothes are fitting better.
you're looking better
you're feeling stronger and are stronger

body fat scales are notoriously inaccurate -the only thing they'll give you is another number to compare againsy.

Iwouldn't be too concerned with loss of lean body mass with all the positives that you've got going..

Yes, I have moved down a few sizes with pants and shirts. I used to wear a 38 waist pant, now Im down to a 34; and I used to wear XL/2XL shirts, and now Im down to a Medium.

Thanks for the reassurance

-joe

 

[Steve]

Did you do serious strength training on a consistent basis before you started losing weight?

Just b/c you got stronger doesn't mean you retained or gained your muscle. This is the case especially if your answer to the above question is 'no.'

Strength is a manifestation of multiple factors. In the early stages, which this seems to be, of a training program.... people have the ability to get a lot stronger without adding a lot or any muscle. This happens for reasons we don't need to get into here.

It seems like your rate of weight loss per week was on the high side. That leads me to believe your calories were low. That might be okay assuming your strength training program is sufficient and your protein intake is adequate.

In general though, the deeper you go calorically speaking, the greater the chance of losing an appreciable amount of LBM.

 

[zkay]

No, I had not been strength training before I started losing weight, in fact it took a few weeks into the diet for my kettlebell to actually arrive, so the weight loss started before the weight lifting.

I've gained visible muscle on the arms, back and shoulders, and have kept protein intake high (almost always between .8-1g of protein per lb). Up until this week I'd been consistently lifting 3 days a week, and doing cardio the other three days.

The one constant in all this is my caloric intake; it only ever fluctuates between 1500-2100, and rarely hits below 1400. I'd just been following the guideline on thedailyplate.com for someone of my height, weight and age to lose 2 pounds a week.

Thanks,
-joe

[EDIT 1: Syntax]

 

[Steve]

No, I had not been strength training before I started losing weight, in fact it took a few weeks into the diet for my kettlebell to actually arrive, so the weight loss started before the weight lifting.

So that solidifies my point from above about getting stronger with out adding appreciable muscle mass, especially in the early stages of a strength training program.

It mostly has to do with neurological adaptations.

I've gained visible muscle on the arms, back and shoulders,

If you've never strength trained before.... you very well could have. Novices get to experience, though awesome, short-lived magic where they can relatively easy lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously. Of course their genetics need to be aligned with this too... but you get the point.

That said though, a good number of people (by that I mean almost all) who lose an appreciable amount of weight confuse the exposure of existing muscles when fat is lost with muscle gain. It's a huge optical illusion.

Even with me personally. I go through periods of cutting and bulking. There are many times where I look in the mirror and I appear to be 'bigger' and more muscular at 180 as I do at 205.

Leaning out does awesome things to the body.

In your personal situation, I'd be willing to bet you gained a little muscle from the 'newbie effect' associated with strength training and had the pleasant surprise of learning you had a good bit of muscle under the fat you lost.

and have kept protein intake high (almost always between .8-1g of protein per lb). Up until this week I'd been consistently lifting 3 days a week, and doing cardio the other three days.

Sounds like a solid game plan!

 

[zkay]

This week has been strange. My dad had a heart attack recently and so can't really do any heavy labor, so all this past week I've been helping him do things in the yard, the garden, etc.

The garden is about 8x20, and the worst section of the yard I worked was 30x30. For two days I shoveled / turned over soil in the garden, raked/scraped off the majority of the top layer that had accumulated since last summer (dead leaves, crappy dirt, etc) and shoveled this into a pile; I'd guess it was approximately 150-200lbs of garbage material.

In the 30x30 section I was using a sickle to clear weeds that had grown to be about as tall as I am. On any of the given days I was outside working 3-5 hours. I should mention that before I started all this weightloss business, I was practically a shut in. Before this week I'd guess the last time I was out in the sun for that long at a time was 2 years ago.

On Sunday, 6/1/08 I weighed in at 185.5 / 186 (scale couldn't decide). Today, Thursday, 6/5/08 I weighed in at 183. Last night I was working with both my 53lb and 35lb kettlebells, and managed the following (totals):

53lb:

14 presses
47 bent rows
13 jerks

35lb:

60 presses
40 bent rows
6 get ups (This is where you lock the kettlebell up above you in one arm and then get up and stand up with it locked out the entire time, optimally only using your shoulders / back)

General:

30 pushups
30 crunches

--

All this took me about 45-50 minutes. I try to stop all my strength days around 45-50 minutes in because I've read and heard many places that testosterone drops off after this long, and diminishing returns start to play a part.

Yesterday, as every day for breakfast I had a bowl of plain oatmeal with craisins (dried cranberries) added. For lunch it was better part of a can of tuna, two servings of success brown rice, an orange and a package of brussel sprouts. After lunch is when I was out in the yard working. When I came in I had 2 bubba burgers and some chicken and laid about a while, falling asleep about 2 hours later for around 2-3 hours.

I'm also sick with a cold, if that might play any part.

--

Basically I'm wondering if I'm eating enough. On thedailyplate.com it asks for your activity level; I've always left it at lightly active because when I'm not working with the kettlebell I'm generally in front of my computer or at school. I asked my mom, an RN, and my brother (who used to be a bodybuilder) and both of them said that it was probably water weight lost.

Thank you,
-joe

 

[zkay]

Well I answered my own question. Someone of my height, weight, age and activity level should apparently be eating approximately 1915 calories to lose 2 pounds a week.

I made a mistake in the activity level; apparently someone that works out 6 days a week for about 30-60 minutes is considered moderately active :/

I hope I haven't done any damage.

-joe

 

[allyphoe]

Basically I'm wondering if I'm eating enough. On thedailyplate.com it asks for your activity level; I've always left it at lightly active because when I'm not working with the kettlebell I'm generally in front of my computer or at school.

I leave mine set at "seated work" on Fitday, which I suspect is similar to "lightly active," then add in exercise over and above my normal daily routine. That has always given me a calories-burned number consistent with the results I've seen.

 

[zkay]

I leave mine set at "seated work" on Fitday, which I suspect is similar to "lightly active," then add in exercise over and above my normal daily routine. That has always given me a calories-burned number consistent with the results I've seen.

I did this for a period of time on dailyplate, it just seemed very..tedious. More so than counting calories. Good idea, though.

-joe

 

[zkay]

For anyone that finds themselves in my same situation, I think I've come up with an ideal solution. I've always instinctively zig zagged my caloric intake; but I do believe that at the level of activity I'm currently at, the system I've set up works well.

Keep in mind that at 5'9 and 183LB I'm at a BMR of approximately 2000 calories.

On cardio days (swings w/kettlebell, swimming, running, etc) I eat between 1500-1700 calories.

On strength days, (presses, rows, jerks and get ups w/kettlebell) I eat between 1600-1900 calories.

On any given day I try to consume between 100-160 grams of protein, through food. At my current weight this is between .54g-.87g of protein per pound. On strength days I try to consume more, as .8-1g is recommended for building significant muscle mass and strength.

The past two weeks I've lost 1.5lbs->2LBs respectively, so this seems to be working so far.

The last 2 weeks have gone 186LB->184.5LB->182.5LB.

Thanks,
-zkay