I don't know where to start, please help.

L

Le Guen

0
Hi,

I am 22 years old, weigh 215lbs, and I'm 6ft 1 in height.
I'm not in good shape, I have a little flab under my chin, and a fat belly.

My aim is as follows: To have a toned muscular body, buff but not 'massive' like a competitive body builder.

So after reading this forum for several months without registering, I decided that I'd start bulking
The reason I've done this is:

> To gain muscle mass
> To gain strength
> To gain toning, and a decent chest!

But now I'm a little lost. I was wondering if you guys have an opinion on the following question:

Should an overweight man bulk to gain muscle if ultimately he wants to lose fat?

I've really enjoyed bulking, eating lots of protein and lifting weights 4 times a week. I figure that because it costs calories to maintain muscle, building some decent biceps, triceps, and a chest would be the best way to combat the fat.

What do you guys think? Please answer! Many thanks.
 
depends how overweight you are.. And its really mostly about what you want to do. If you are obsese i would cut down fat first (while weight training) and then bulk afterwards. But i dont know how overweight you say you are? got a picture or how tall are you, how old, how much you weigh?
 
Not obese, but possibly a few pounds over.

I'm 6'1, poss 6'2. I weigh 215lbs. I have a small amount of fat under the chin, and a 'beer belly'

My theory is: Extra muscle = more calorie use = fat loss
 
if you are overweight then you are already bulking because that means you are eating over maintanance so just lift more and do more cardio.
 
Congrats

First I wanted to congratulate you on taking this first step to better health. While it may not seem significant now, taking these steps now will set your body up well for the future by decreasing your chance of diabetes, heart attack and all other kinds of bad things.

That said, Buzz is right you are already bulking, now you just need to lift in order to shape the muscles you already have.

In my experience, kinda coming from where you are (I am 5'11 and used to weigh about 230 - I am now 185) my suggestion would be to really hit the cardio hard. Don't neglect weight training, but make sure you really stick to your cardio regement. For me, I found that hitting my target heart rate and maintaining that for like at least 30 minutes seemed to really shed the pounds. Of course, your results may vary, but that's what worked for me.

Also, you absolutely have to watch your diet. My suggestion is to start small, and make little adjustments. One thing that was HUGE for me, I stopped drinking regular soda and switched to diet. I hated the taste at first, but got used to it. Between that and really cutting my sugar intake...the results were huge. After that I gradually started to adjust portion size. I still ate pretty much what I wanted but just in lesser amounts.

I'm not going to say go on this crazy, eating every 2 - 3 hours diet, which works...but for me is impossible (I'm a network engineer, and eating around computers especially expensive ones, is a no-no). So I ate my regular Breakfast, lunch, and dinner (with adjusted portions). But I did go out and buy a protein shake type deal for an evening snack.

Anyway, good luck!!!
 
Thank you all for your informative answers.

Snaggle, could you elaborate on a couple of things for me?

you just need to lift in order to shape the muscles you already have.
Click to expand...

Do you mean that I will have bigger arm muscles if I stop overfeeding, but carry on lifting? I would like to increase muscle mass. Surely 'cutting' in the way you mention will make me skinny?

hitting your target heart rate and maintaining that for like at least 30 minutes
Click to expand...

What is a target heart rate?

So to summarise, if I am to cut down on my calorie intake, and take regular exercise including strength training, I will not become real skinny?

Thanks again for your kind words.
 
It depends how skinny you are now and for how long you cut and how much muscle mass you got under your fat now. And its really up to you what you do, but dont overfeed yourself, you wont make the body gain more muscle by eat TONS of food, the body has a limit for how much muscle it can make in a week, and if you eat over that limit, it will put on fat.
 
You can't really 'shape' muscles per se. You can build them and lose the fat that's obscuring them, though. Hit the cardio like they're saying, watch your diet, and keep on the weights. If your protein intake is high enough you can still gain a bit of muscle while losing the fat. It's harder to do than bulking and then dieting and exercising to get rid of the fat, but better for your body in the long term.

Target hart rate is 220 minus your age times 55% (for the minimum of the target range) and 90% (for the maximum). That makes it between 109 and 178, but where in that range you want to be depends on your aerobic fitness level. Since you're not in good shape, shoot for 109 - 130 range and work your way up.
 
trainerbob said:
You can't really 'shape' muscles per se. You can build them and lose the fat that's obscuring them, though. Hit the cardio like they're saying, watch your diet, and keep on the weights. If your protein intake is high enough you can still gain a bit of muscle while losing the fat. It's harder to do than bulking and then dieting and exercising to get rid of the fat, but better for your body in the long term.

Target hart rate is 220 minus your age times 55% (for the minimum of the target range) and 90% (for the maximum). That makes it between 109 and 178, but where in that range you want to be depends on your aerobic fitness level. Since you're not in good shape, shoot for 109 - 130 range and work your way up.
Click to expand...


Trainerbob speaks the truth. He expresses more clearly what I meant. Muscles are what they are, and by shaping I just meant making them bigger, more defined and what not. He also hit's that target heart rate right on the nose. As far as the actual scientific numbers, couldn't tell you. But from personal experience, when I started doing the target heart rate training, I found myself losing fat much quicker than when I would just go out running

Karky also speaks much truth. Over eating, is over eating. Excess calories not burned or excreted turn into fat. Diet and Mass building are not mutually exclusive. If you want big daddy arms and lose weight, then you are going to have to adjust your diet and probably look into supplements. Your muscles will grow as long as you give them the building blocks to do so.

Good luck.
 
its difficult working meals into your work so,if you eat what you are now and do more cardio/weights you can create a defecit,but go for the low fat high protein option.
you can also create a defecit by eating less but this option means you are not likely to buid any muscle.
IMO increase exercise while eating healthy meals if you dont lose any weight drop your cals slightly.
 
Status: online here is a good explanation from lyle macdonald. about

gaining muscle while losing fat: The Newbie effect

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok, since this seems to come up with some regularity, here are my thoughts on it. I had made a post to mfw a long time bck but it's faster to just retype it here than try to dig through google groups.

The basic question that continues to come up is "How come newbies can gain muscle and lose fat but more advanced guys can't."

First and foremost, I want to point out that only fat newbies can accomplish this, lean guys are not going to lean out significantly while gaining muscle. And I think this points us partly in the right direction.

Way back when, when I first got on the track of leptin (oh, about 98 I think), a lot of what leptin was doing (and note that leptin is related to bodyfat levels) seemed to explain at least part of this. Leptin turned out to be the big missing middle puzzle piece that I"d been looking for for about 10 years.

So consider a fat untrained individual. Because of all of the bodyfat they are carrying, there are a bunch of adapations that have occurred which, given the right stimulus, is going to make them *more effectively* mobilize fat for fuel. I know I"ve discussed this before but now expect a zillion and one questions.

But when you look at that actual adaptations in terms of whole body (especially fat cell) insulin resistance, it's clear that they occur in an attempt to limit further fat gain/help with fat loss once the excess calories are removed. The fat cells are resistant to insulin (meaning insulin can't be anti-lipolytic) leptin would be limiting food intake if the brain weren't resistant, leptin is trying to push fatty acid oxidation (except that muscle is alos resistant), there are tons of fatty acids n the bloodstream just waiting to be burned, &c. So even in the face of high insulin or whatever, fatty acids can be mobilize for fuel.

Read that last sentence again, especially given the role of insulin in muscle growth.

So I think that's the first part of the story. The body is primed to use a lot of fat for fuel under those conditions. Going back to 98, this is actually what led me to leptin, trying to figure out why fatter people can lose fat with less LBM loss compared to lean. So I started looking at the differences physiologically in fat people vs. lean people. And kept coming back to leptin (which I'd been deliberately ignoring for years). Which turns out to be part (but certainly not the entire picture). But I digress.

But it's not the whole story. The other part of it and at this point I get way off into speculation land I think has to do with being relatively more untrained. Everybody knows that beginners respond better to training than anybody else. Primarily because they are so far from their genetic potential. They have more 'room to grow' to put it one way. This is true of everything, first year of any training is when you will make the most massive gains, unless you're training is retarded. And as you get closer to your genetic limits, things start to level off and you reach an asymptote.

And I think that the two factors together are what allow it to happen.

You're in a situation where
a. muscle can be gained quite easily
b. fat can be lost quite easily

Because both are so far below (in the case of muscle) or above (in the case of fat) genetic limits. That's on top of all the hormonal/energetic stuff going on when you're fat. The body is trying to push fatty acids away from storage and towards fat oxidation, even in the face of a relatively anabolic hormonal state.

But a fat but trained individual doesn't have both factors going no. They may have plenty of fat to lose but they don't have a ton of muscle to gain. No newbie effect.

A semi-lean but muscular individual has to drop insulin to mobilize/burn fat for fuel at any effective rate. Which limits their anabolic potential (and this is ignoring all of the stuff going on in the muscle with AMPk and protien synthesis and all that crap). They can lose fat but they can't gain muscle at the same time.

And, in a muscle gaining mode, you're in a net anabolic state anyhow. You can't lose fat and gain muscle at the same time for the most part.

Now quit asking me about this.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top