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Multiple sets
- Thread starter SKMMAN
- Start date
more volume. for one exersice. Do you understand why for one muscle group? if so, its the same reason.
Are you currently only doing one set per muscle group per workout?
You train yourself for a bigger workload with more sets, and generally, more sets means more volume, and is better for size gains. Lets use this example.
3x5 and 5x5 or you could use 1x5 and 5x5 if you wish, just to have one with only one set.
3x5 or 1x5 would be higher intensity on each set than the 5x5. 5x5 is more volume, it gives more size than 3x5 would do. Thats why 5x5 are so popular.
I remember reading a study for beginners, which said only one set was needed for muscle strenght, that might be true, but when you have been training for a while its a different story. Also, like mentioned, you train to be able to tolerate a higher workload.
Example:
Person A is doing 1x5 and person B is doing 5x5
Person A is doing 200 pounds for his one set of 5
Person B attempts to do 1x5 and he hits 195 pounds.
Person A tries doing 5x5, (keeping weight constant on all sets) to be able to finish all 5 sets he has to go down to 185 pounds
while person B, who has been training with 5x5 can do it with 190 pounds, because he has trained for higher workload
This is just an example, so dont read into the numbers, just see the big picture with the example.
Atleast this is the way i see it.
If that study wasnt in norwegian i would dig it up and provide a link.
you might wanna send buzz a PM, ive seen him post studies like frenzy, maybe he has something on this topic.
heres a link to his profile: http://training.fitness.com/members/buzz.html
Are you currently only doing one set per muscle group per workout?
You train yourself for a bigger workload with more sets, and generally, more sets means more volume, and is better for size gains. Lets use this example.
3x5 and 5x5 or you could use 1x5 and 5x5 if you wish, just to have one with only one set.
3x5 or 1x5 would be higher intensity on each set than the 5x5. 5x5 is more volume, it gives more size than 3x5 would do. Thats why 5x5 are so popular.
I remember reading a study for beginners, which said only one set was needed for muscle strenght, that might be true, but when you have been training for a while its a different story. Also, like mentioned, you train to be able to tolerate a higher workload.
Example:
Person A is doing 1x5 and person B is doing 5x5
Person A is doing 200 pounds for his one set of 5
Person B attempts to do 1x5 and he hits 195 pounds.
Person A tries doing 5x5, (keeping weight constant on all sets) to be able to finish all 5 sets he has to go down to 185 pounds
while person B, who has been training with 5x5 can do it with 190 pounds, because he has trained for higher workload
This is just an example, so dont read into the numbers, just see the big picture with the example.
Atleast this is the way i see it.
If that study wasnt in norwegian i would dig it up and provide a link.
you might wanna send buzz a PM, ive seen him post studies like frenzy, maybe he has something on this topic.
heres a link to his profile: http://training.fitness.com/members/buzz.html
Last edited:
an expanation from the HST board.
Keep in mind that some signaling proteins are turned on by the combination of time and tension, sometimes referred to as the “time-tension integral”, and others are turned on primarily by the magnitude of tension without regard to time. Nevertheless, both signal-types will respond with a flattened out bell curve. There is a point where the signaling response to the stressor is at maximum. Further load and/or volume will not elicit a greater response.
So yes, there is "a point of growth/no growth". That point is determined by the Load, the Volume, and the level of Conditioning of the tissue. To understand this we have to look at what has to happen to the muscle during a workout in order to get it to grow.
In order of importance:
1) Satellite cells must be activated, differentiated, and fuse with existing fibers, donating their nuclei.
2) Mechanical stress must be transmitted to the sarcolemma (mechanotransduction) and contractile protein structures within the sarcomeres. This will trigger focal adhesion kinases (FAK) that in turn initiate the downstream signaling events leading to an increase the contractile and cytoskeletal protein expression/synthesis.
3) pH and oxidative stress must be acutely increased within the muscle fiber.
Focusing just on the workout, this pretty much sums it up. If #1 doesn’t happen, you will not grow…ever. If number two doesn’t happen, you will grow a little, but you will soon reach the limits of the sarcoplasmic/nuclear ratio and growth will stop. If #3 doesn’t happen, you will still grow quite significantly, but the rate of growth might be enhanced or facilitated if #3 is achieved.
#1 is achieved when a certain level of microtrauma is experienced by the fibers. This is brought about by load, eccentric contractions, and to a much lesser extent, hypoxia (A.K.A. #3) When load, eccentric contractions and #3 occur, each fiber will produce and release muscle specific-IGF-1 (sometimes called mechano-growth factor) The IGF-1 in turn seeps out of leaky sarcolemmas and acts on nescient satellite cells to initiate #1. Microtrauma is rapidly reduced from workout to workout (Repeated bout effect) thereby limiting the effectiveness of any given load to induce further hypertrophy.
#2 is achieved by loading a muscle that is actively contracting.
#3 is achieved by contracting a muscle (doing reps) until you create an oxygen deficit and subsequent hypoxic byproducts (e.g. lactate and oxygen radicals).
The afore mentioned physiological principles of muscle growth are what we follow in order to ensure that 1,2 and 3 happen.
1 set is not necessarily "better" than 3 sets.
As far as muscle hypertrophy is concerned, high duration of load is best. The cellular signals that are initiated by strain on the structural and contractile proteins of the cell are increased as time under load increases. If it weren't for the involvement of fatigue in performing the actual reps and sets, you would be better off doing tons of sets and reps.
HST uses lower numbers of sets because the muscle is trained much more often. So, the muscle isn't actually loaded for less time, its just that the loading is more evenly spread out over time to keep the signal more constant. If there are any factors that allow a person to do more sets per workout, he/she should do them.
From what other research there is on the time course of genetic expression in response to overload, it is clear that we don’t even come close the amount of time needed to elicit the greatest hypertrophic effect. But what are you going to do? We have to lift the weight a lower it over and over in order to overload the muscle. From the overload research, I personally feel longer time under tension is better. But you have to balance that with CNS fatigue, and absolute load.
More sets with heavier weight is better than fewer sets with less weight. But there is a limit to our exercise tolerance. So you have to figure out a way to get as much loading of the muscle as you can, as often as you can, and still be able to constantly increase the load over time, without burning out or getting injured.
Keep in mind that some signaling proteins are turned on by the combination of time and tension, sometimes referred to as the “time-tension integral”, and others are turned on primarily by the magnitude of tension without regard to time. Nevertheless, both signal-types will respond with a flattened out bell curve. There is a point where the signaling response to the stressor is at maximum. Further load and/or volume will not elicit a greater response.
So yes, there is "a point of growth/no growth". That point is determined by the Load, the Volume, and the level of Conditioning of the tissue. To understand this we have to look at what has to happen to the muscle during a workout in order to get it to grow.
In order of importance:
1) Satellite cells must be activated, differentiated, and fuse with existing fibers, donating their nuclei.
2) Mechanical stress must be transmitted to the sarcolemma (mechanotransduction) and contractile protein structures within the sarcomeres. This will trigger focal adhesion kinases (FAK) that in turn initiate the downstream signaling events leading to an increase the contractile and cytoskeletal protein expression/synthesis.
3) pH and oxidative stress must be acutely increased within the muscle fiber.
Focusing just on the workout, this pretty much sums it up. If #1 doesn’t happen, you will not grow…ever. If number two doesn’t happen, you will grow a little, but you will soon reach the limits of the sarcoplasmic/nuclear ratio and growth will stop. If #3 doesn’t happen, you will still grow quite significantly, but the rate of growth might be enhanced or facilitated if #3 is achieved.
#1 is achieved when a certain level of microtrauma is experienced by the fibers. This is brought about by load, eccentric contractions, and to a much lesser extent, hypoxia (A.K.A. #3) When load, eccentric contractions and #3 occur, each fiber will produce and release muscle specific-IGF-1 (sometimes called mechano-growth factor) The IGF-1 in turn seeps out of leaky sarcolemmas and acts on nescient satellite cells to initiate #1. Microtrauma is rapidly reduced from workout to workout (Repeated bout effect) thereby limiting the effectiveness of any given load to induce further hypertrophy.
#2 is achieved by loading a muscle that is actively contracting.
#3 is achieved by contracting a muscle (doing reps) until you create an oxygen deficit and subsequent hypoxic byproducts (e.g. lactate and oxygen radicals).
The afore mentioned physiological principles of muscle growth are what we follow in order to ensure that 1,2 and 3 happen.
1 set is not necessarily "better" than 3 sets.
As far as muscle hypertrophy is concerned, high duration of load is best. The cellular signals that are initiated by strain on the structural and contractile proteins of the cell are increased as time under load increases. If it weren't for the involvement of fatigue in performing the actual reps and sets, you would be better off doing tons of sets and reps.
HST uses lower numbers of sets because the muscle is trained much more often. So, the muscle isn't actually loaded for less time, its just that the loading is more evenly spread out over time to keep the signal more constant. If there are any factors that allow a person to do more sets per workout, he/she should do them.
From what other research there is on the time course of genetic expression in response to overload, it is clear that we don’t even come close the amount of time needed to elicit the greatest hypertrophic effect. But what are you going to do? We have to lift the weight a lower it over and over in order to overload the muscle. From the overload research, I personally feel longer time under tension is better. But you have to balance that with CNS fatigue, and absolute load.
More sets with heavier weight is better than fewer sets with less weight. But there is a limit to our exercise tolerance. So you have to figure out a way to get as much loading of the muscle as you can, as often as you can, and still be able to constantly increase the load over time, without burning out or getting injured.