Auto-Regulation in Strength and Power Training

[goergen1]

Apparently I am becoming a more motivated thread starter.

Here is my topic of the day.

Auto-Regulation - Training in such a way that the body's preparedness dictates the type, volume, and intensity of training for the specific reason of training at a maximal effectiveness while consistently avoiding over-reaching and over-training.

Conjugate training - The use of many different training methods within the same training cycle (week/month) with the objective of developing different aspects of training at the same time.

In our training we use an Auto-Regulation Conjugate method, or ARC training.

Each training day begins with a test. (which does not always make it into my journal) Some days we use the overhead shot heave, other days we use the Tendo. Then based upon the performance in the test of the day we choose a workout. The choices are -

A. Power Day
B. Strength Day
C. Work Capacity Day

These are in that specific order because power days are the most taxing, followed by strength days then work capacity days. Each day has different exercise options as well to ensure that there is maximum variety.

We find this to be a good method of letting the body tell us what it is prepared for, instead of forcing training that may not be the best choice for the day.

There are also methods of auto-regulating the training for the specific day. Using various drop-off methods. Again, letting the body tell us the volume it is prepared to do as opposed to forcing an amount of training that may not be optimal for that training day.

My questions to start this thread off are.

1. Do you have experience with auto-regulation training? If so, what is your take on this training method?

2. Does anyone have any other ideas for auto-regulating the training the type of training for the day?

3. Does anyone have any creative ideas on how to auto-regulate the training day?

(this question could be for endurance athletes as well. I have had pretty good success with some basic auto-regulation when training clients for 1/2 marathons and the like. admittedly I am not an aerobic exercise guy, so the methods most likely could have been a lot better)

Please answer these questions, or ask some questions of your own. It will be good for everyone.

I appreciate any feedback. Thanks for reading this post.

 

[Karky]

You know how your resting heart rate will be higher if you're overtrained?
Can you take our HR in the morning before getting out of bed and decide from that what kind of training to do?
I don't know how sensible HR is, will you be able to detect small enough differences from your resting HR? And I'm sure it will naturally vary some..
Think it could work? or are the problems I mentioned too big/other problems?

I also thought morning temp.. the higher your metabolism the higher the temp.. but I don't know if there is a clear difference between how "overtrained" you are and your metabolism/morning temp.

 

[goergen1]

HHHmmmmm........

I have mixed feelings about the heart rate thing. It is good to keep track of. There are a couple of things I can think of about it.

1. It is a good measure of over-training.
2. Once you have an elevated heart rate in the morning it may be too late. Maybe the heart rate is a "time to take a week off" measurement. Not so much a daily training measurement.
3. I have noticed that when my daily testing method is dialed in, my heart rate in the morning never has enough variance to base anything off of. (a couple beats does not seem valid enough to base different workouts on)

Personally I believe that the test should reflect the preparedness of the nervous system.

I agree that the temperature method seems unreliable. So it really could not be used.

The Bulgarians, back in the 90's when they had the best weightlifting team in the world, would take a daily max in the Olympic lifts. That max would dictate what the training weight for the day was. The belief was that the body would wave intensity and volume all by itself. (of course I believe this only works well for more highly trained athletes. Specifically athletes who only train for their sport, not people with jobs and other things going on in life)

The Russians came up with measuring hand strength. It was found that hand strength was a fairly accurate measure of overall body preparedness. You would need a hand dynamometer to test for this.

What do you think about auto-regulating the specific exercises in a workout? How eould you go about doing this?

 

[flyinfree]

wow! I may get into the overtraining mode 'at time.' hahha

but with the strength training being the topic. I am not clear as whether YOU train to the weakness, or the strength? So if your throw(?) is strong you re-enforce that, or you do the next test, looking for what is weak, and then train to the weakness?

and how about fatigue'feeling' regardless of performance. Sometimes if i have a fatigue, and i have decide to 'do it anyways' my brain can torure that part, and many times i will see a superior performance. ie: pushing thru tired legs and an early "wall"- can almost create a euphoric state, and then I get smooth and fast.

 

[goergen1]

I am not clear as whether YOU train to the weakness, or the strength? So if your throw(?) is strong you re-enforce that, or you do the next test, looking for what is weak, and then train to the weakness?

There would only be one test per day. For instance -

On one of my days the test is the overhead shot heave. (throw the shot backwards as far as possible. Usually 8-10 attempts) If the shot is within 3% of my PR, then it is a power training day. If it is within 3-8% of my PR is is a strength training day. If it is more than 8% from my PR it is a work capacity day.

and how about fatigue'feeling' regardless of performance. Sometimes if i have a fatigue, and i have decide to 'do it anyways' my brain can torure that part, and many times i will see a superior performance. ie: pushing thru tired legs and an early "wall"- can almost create a euphoric state, and then I get smooth and fast.

That is the best part. Sometimes the best days are when you feel like crap. Sometimes you feel like a million bucks and test out terrible. With this method you are training what your body is prepared for, not what your mind thinks you need. (often very different things )

Lets say, for example FF, you test a standing broad jump on lifting days. (you would take a week to set some benchmarks for the test) then you could choose training like this.

1. Within 3 inches of your PR. Power training day. This is the day you could emphasize your cleans, jerks, jumping / sprinting exercise, and faster movements.

2. 3-6 inches from your PR. Strength training day. Here you would emphasize heavy type lifting. Squats, deadlifts, and heavier training.

3. 6+ inches from your PR. Work capacity day. Here you would emphasize more reps, circuits, general conditioning type exercise.

(I chose the inch range as a baseline, that part may end up being different for you)

This type of thing can be great for endurance athletes because the effect of long rides, runs, and swims is hard to figure when it comes to weight training. You may find that you end up training a certain type of weight training more often because that is what your body needs.

(since you are in here FF I think I will start an auto-regulating endurance training thread sometime this coming week. It will be interesting to expand on some thoughts there as well )

 

[flyinfree]

ok`! i am getting what you mean now. And this is based on a pre-tense of an upper / lower split?

the broad jump would work for lower body weight designated days.

I also see the difference you mean now, by Power/Strength/ and Work Capacity.

What would be a good test for me on upper days?

maybe this week I can try a few days and get soem bench marks. I will not be working out much this week at all. i am in a recovery week. But this would be a good project to keep my momentum in advancement up.

 

[goergen1]

And this is based on a pre-tense of an upper / lower split?

Well, I do not use a traditional split or full body workout. I do train lower and upper body every workout, so the lower body tests are the only ones I use.

What would be a good test for me on upper days?

We found the upper body a lot harder to test for. The only test that has been successful for the upper body is a plio push-up using the tendo to measure maximum speed.

Originally I was using a kneeling med ball chest throw or a med ball kneeling overhead throw. Both measuring distance for the day. What I found out was that there is really not enough variance in performance to make these throws valid tests. Even using the tendo to measure speed at the wrist did not have enough variance.

I believe the med ball throws would be more accurate if the ball was heavier. Like 40lbs or 50lbs. There may be enough variance in performance to make that work.

On the other hand. The upper body recovers faster than the lower body. These tests may not have worked well because, at the time, I was not training upper body frequently enough to elicit any change in performance of the tests I was using.

Some creativity may be needed to come up with a good upper body test.

This raises another question. Being that you are an endurance athlete, would it not be more effective to train both upper and lower body exercises on your weight training days? Using a method of more frequency, but less volume per body part per workout?

Just throwing some thoughts out there.

 

[jpfitness]

I don't know if conjugate periodization and autoreg are necessarily a good mix since ideally you want to train the same movement patterns as soon as you're supercompensating, versus hitting the various types of strength throughout the weak.

Maybe you could simply apply the autoreg concept to an individual workout, but as applied to a program -- depending on the amount of fatigue you induce -- you should technically do the same exercises a few days later during supercompensation.

For example, you work squat, DL, bench press and bent-over rows. If you train at 5% fatigue you would fatigue faster, but be in SC within 2-3 days, whereas if you train at 10% fatigue you wouldn't SC for 4-5 days, but to actually test your recovery you technically need to do the same or very similar workout.

It would be harder to track fatigue in a conjugate program. Although technically all programs are more or less shades of AR.

The beauty of AR is that you really can't overtrain since the maximum you give in any given workout is determined by your neural efficiency at that time. I personally think it's a great way to train. In my slightly younger days I used that method. I'm off to new frontiers in training now though.

I think it's ideal for a strength athlete, but technically it works for ANY goal because you determine your work weight on your "best effort" lift in a given rep scheme, which will be determined by your goal.

Str: 4-6 reps, str/hyp: 6-8 reps, hyp: 8-12 reps, hyp/end: 12-15 reps, and end: 15+ reps.

 

[jpfitness]

On things like throwing or static moves (lateral holds, hanging with lower traps contracted, etc), you simply apply the AR formula to time instead of weight. For example, if you do static lateral holds with 20 DBs for 30 seconds and you wish to be in SC in two days, you would train at 5% fatigue, which means that your subsequent work sets would be 20 lb holds for 28 sec (close enough) until your first form drop-off.

 

[goergen1]

jpfitness - You have hit on a couple of things that I was hoping would come into this thread.

I don't know if conjugate periodization and autoreg are necessarily a good mix since ideally you want to train the same movement patterns as soon as you're supercompensating, versus hitting the various types of strength throughout the weak.

We have found just the opposite. That conjugate training and areg go hand in hand. Mostly because of the variance on different training days. For example -

If I test for a power day on Tuesday I will be doing power exercises. (jumps, vertimax, Olympic Type movements)

When I train again on Thursday I may not test a power day. I may test a strength day. So my exercises would be different. (squat, deadlift for example)

Basically we are tracking nervous system fatigue on a workout to workout basis.

We have seen really great results from this.

I do not believe that training an exercise more than once a week is the route to go. That is just my experience speaking. Areg or not the results do not seem to be as good.

JP - you got into auto-regulating individual workouts as well. That has proven a very useful thing for us. We regulate everything. For example -

1. Power exercises are measured for maximal speed. Sets are done until speed reaches a specific drop-off point. 5% or 10% are usually the direction I take. (10% not that often, generally because I end up doing between 20 and 30 sets)

2. Throws. When we are throwing we will train throws for a PR on the day. We give ourselves 5 more throws after the farthest to beat the best throw. If we beat it, 5 more throws, if not, training for that throw is over.

If you train at 5% fatigue you would fatigue faster, but be in SC within 2-3 days, whereas if you train at 10% fatigue you wouldn't SC for 4-5 days

For everyone who is interested, here is what is meant by 5% or 10% fatigue.

Say the reps for the day are 6 on a given exercise. Train up to a 6 reps max. Then drop the weight 5% or 10% (or whatever % is necessary) then train sets of 6 until 6 reps is not longer doable. (generally a breakdown in technique)(the examples of areg I have given are examples are in no way exhaust the possibilities)

I think it's ideal for a strength athlete, but technically it works for ANY goal because you determine your work weight on your "best effort" lift in a given rep scheme, which will be determined by your goal.

Thats the coolest part. When I was a trainer I would areg circuits for my clients. (one example) I took the time it takes to complete a circuit. They would do that circuit until they could not complete it in under 110% of their best time. (had a lot of great results with this, sort of like your example with static holds)

Thanks for the posts JP.

 

[jpfitness]

We have found just the opposite. That conjugate training and areg go hand in hand. Mostly because of the variance on different training days. For example -

If I test for a power day on Tuesday I will be doing power exercises. (jumps, vertimax, Olympic Type movements)

When I train again on Thursday I may not test a power day. I may test a strength day. So my exercises would be different. (squat, deadlift for example)

Basically we are tracking nervous system fatigue on a workout to workout basis.

We have seen really great results from this.

I do not believe that training an exercise more than once a week is the route to go. That is just my experience speaking. Areg or not the results do not seem to be as good.

That's awesome, and makes total sense now that you explained it.

I guess I was too focused on hitting the same movement patterns, but it makes total sense that you do your DE day when you are supercompensating. Technically the focus of AR is testing your best effort in each workout, then basing the your workloads on your neural efficiency for that day, so it makes total sense that you could integrate conjugate periodization with Areg.

Thanks for the cool info!