Critic my new routine

T

Tomahawk

0
I've been doing this routine for the past 2 weeks since i've joined the gym again. For background information for those unfamilair with me is that I started a diet program January 06 and started out weighing 263 and currently weigh 204. My goal is to be 180 by June. Which is very achievable. Now i'm not nearly as fat as I use to be but you can imagine I need to tighten up a lot. Now i've mostly done cardio in throughout my diet 4-5 times a week and strength training really lacked. I'd do it on and off and so forth.

About 6 weeks ago I really started getting into weight training making sure I do it at least 3 days a week. I started with an upper/lower body routine for the first 4 weeks but have recently moved away from that choosing to go with strength training 5 days a week in a 4 split routine. Now I choose this new routine because I like to give each body part more exercises cause I love that tight feeling and actually feeling that I worked specific body parts well instead of the whole upper body or lower body well. Now this is my typical routine.

Monday - Chest/Triceps
Tuesday - Shoulders/Abs (LISS cardio in the Am)
Wednesday - Back/Biceps
Thursday - off cardio only
Friday - Legs
Saturday- Chest Triceps (LISS cardio in the Am)
Sunday- off cardio only

Now for more detail here are my specific routines.

Routine 1
Chest/Triceps
Dumbell Chest Press
Incline bench press Machine
Chest flys
Pullover Machine

Tricep Press Machine
Dips
Overhead tricep extension

Routine 2
Back/Biceps
Dumbell Row leaning over bench
Lat Pull-Down
Seated rowing Machine

Standing Bicep curls. I mix this up. Alternating or 1 arm at a time.
Machine Arm Curls.
Barbell Curl
Hammer Curls

Routine 3
Shoulders/Abs
Ab crunches
Ab machine stuff

Overhead Press Machine
Lateral raise
Front Raise
Shrugs

Routine 4
Legs
Squats
Leg Press machine
Knee extension Machine
Seated Heel Raise

Please critic I've realized I'm still in my infancy when it comes to weight training and am very open minded to suggestions. Keep in mind though that I prefer focus on only 1 or 2 body parts per session cause I like the feel of really working a body part hard. I've tried the full body routine. Full body circuit training routine. Upper and lower body routine and now this new 4 day split routine. I have to be honest this is by far my favorite routine and one I can stick to and have fun with.

These routines take me about 45 minutes to complete which is good cause i'm not overexerting myself.

But please comment on my routine and maybe If you feel strongly suggest against it, but give me factual well based arguments. Also, if theirs any exercises of vital importance that i'm missing in my routine please alert me or if theirs some exercises that I'm performing that maybe I should eliminate or substitute another exercise let me know. Also, If maybe I should group my exercises in a different combination than I am now. For example instead of doing chest/triceps perhaps I should do biceps/triceps?

I appreciate everyones response and am truely greatful for all the much needed advice I recieve. The countless pages of advice i've recieved over the last year from everyone on this forum has helped me lose weight and get closer to my goal. In the past I may have been a little closed minded and argumentive, but thats just because I was going through hard times in the fitness department. The last 2 weeks have been great in diet and exercise and i've lost 6 pounds after going from 197-210 after months off on and off dieting.

Thanks again for all the advice. I appreciate everyone taking the time to read and comment on my routine.
 
Get rid of all the machine exercises, you can keep the seated row machine, but everything else should go.

Also, 6-7 exercises is a lot, since they're not full body workouts you shouldn't have 6 or 7 exercisees anyway. Once you remove those machine exercises you should have a better number of exercises.

One more thing, it seems like you're concentrating a lot more on your upper body than lower body. Once you remove the leg press and knee extensions you'll only have squats and seated heel raise. Instead of the seated heel raise I recommend standing calf raises, and also try incorporating lunges or deadlifts,.. or a few of the exercises I do now such as bulgarian split-squat and step ups.
 
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though what i really want to say is ditch the bodypart split..

Get rid of machines, for example, instead of leg press, do another variation of the squat.
 
My goal is to tighten up and get somewhat big by June. Thats 4 months how is ditching the split and switching to say an upper and lower body split going to help me establish that goal?
 
more frequency keeps the protein synthesis elevated. in trained individuals, it starts to go down again after 36 or 38 hours, something like that (48 hours in untrained individuals)

thats just one. And me for one dont get why rather go volume than frequency, lets say this is how you're squat stuff is looking

Leg Day:
Back Squat 3x10
Front Squat 3x10
Bulgarian Squats 3x10

So, even by the front squat you will have used alot of energy on the back squat, you wont be able to keep intensity up, lets say it goes something like this for KGs

Back Squat 3x10 100 kg
Front Squat 3x10 80 kg
Bulgarian Squats 3x10 20kg

Now if you did something like this

Monday:
Back squat

Wendsday
Front squat

Friday
Bulgarian squats

..

what do you think the numbers would be compared to the leg day?
thats my personal argument though, why bother training at such high volume when half of it will not be as efficient as it could be with some rest in between?
 
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I agree with Karky, he has a very good point. I've been doing full body for a few weeks, and it is very, very cool. Everytime you go, each muscle group has one or two compounds to do, so they are nice and fresh every time.

I used to do a very similar split, and it netted me very good results. With that said, you still would need to revise a bit. Like they said, get rid of "machine" anything, and you need deadlifts, and lunges for sure. Also, isolation work, in both full body and splits, is almost unnecessary if you really tore it up.
 
Ah about the protein synthesis I have no idea what your talking about karky. Doesn't the body produce protein synthesis just by exercising and I don't go more than 1 day without doing some form of strength training so I dont see the problem.
 
Not to question the knowledge of everyone who is recommending against machines, but to flat out say eliminate all machine work is just nonsense on your behave. In my eyes you lose all credibility by claiming that I should get rid of the machine exercises but providing no evidence, substance, or facts of how machines serve no purpose. Karky, Mark, and wacky you all claim I should ditch the machines but offer no reason why. Surely, you can see i'm a bit skepticle. You guys could just be repeating things you've read on the internet or from other uncreadible sources that free weights are the only way to go and offer the best benifit and thereby think your an authority on the matter but just spout your machines are bad nonsense without ever really being giving a reason why.

I myself am a scholar so i'll quote from a credible text book.
Source: Hesson James, Weight Training For Life. 8th Edition. Copywrite 2007 black hills State university. This weight training textbook has been published in the United States. Austrailia, Brazil, Canada, Mexico, Singapore, Spain, and the United Kingdom. Now you have an idea where i'm getting my information that i'm about to share with you.

Advantages of machines over free weights.

Advantages of MAchines
1) safety. the machine supports the weight and controls the direction of movement, so you don't need a spotter. You should not be able to get trapped under a heavy weight. You can't lose control over the direction of movement. This is an advantage if you will be training alone.

2) Easy to learn and use. Because the machine supports the weight and controls the direction of movement, the exercise movement is easy to learn. On machines it is generally quick and easy to change the resistance. It is quick and eas to move from one exercise machine to the next. This is an advantage if you want to learn the exercise movements quickly and if you want to spend less time weight training.

3) Machine Appeal. Some people are just attracted to machines and gadgets. They often believe that anything that is newer must be better. Some of the machines have tried to provide optimal resistance throught the range of motion of each exercise.

Disadvantages of Free weights

1) Safety
2) Spotter sometimes needed
3) Easy of learning - a lot harder to learn than machines
4) harder to change weight

Now I understand that free weights have a lot of advantages as well thats why I do both. This doesn't have to be an Either or decision one can successfully incorporate both machines and freeweights into their routine successfully, which i've done in my training program.

I started this post for critism, yet no suggestions on the exercises I should be doing except lose the machines and a 4 day split is bad. YET THE GOD OF THESE FORUMS LV HIMSELF USES A 4 DAY SPLIT VERY SIMILAR TO THE ONE I POSTED WHEN HE IS BULKING. But yet you guys claim with no facts, evidence, or sources why my 4 day split routine isn't as beneficial as a full body or upper lower body split.

I'm not trying to be rude or affend anyones judgement. I'm just a little bit skepticle of believing everything as facts without a solid argument supporting by evidence.

Please keep the advice coming as i've admitted I appreciate it and look at it with an open mind. And Karky and others i'm not saying your arguments are wrong its just theirs no substance to them so its hard for me to not be skepticle.

I'll reserve my judgement until I hear from some of the real forum veterans who have established credibility such as LV and Mreik.
 
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Karky wrote:
what do you think the numbers would be compared to the leg day?
thats my personal argument though, why bother training at such high volume when half of it will not be as efficient as it could be with some rest in between?

I don't understand this statement. You claim earlier on that I need more frequency than volume. The 4 day I'm doing provides plenty of rest in between. About 5 days of rest in between each body part is what it comes down to. yet your say its not as effective as if I had some rest in between. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you but I don't understand how that makes any sense. First you say I should have more frequency than volume and then you turn around and say I should rest more inbetween which is saying I should have lest frequency to allow more rest. I'm confused karky.

On a side note. How old are you karky and how long have you been involved in strength training. What type of program do you incorporate?
 
Here is an excellent read regarding free weights vs. machines:



and here, a quote from sportsmedicine.about.com
Research has shown us that free weights promote quicker strength gains and they require more balance and coordination than do the weight machines. Free weights recruit more muscle groups than variable resistance machines, which tend to only isolate specific muscles.

Free weights are also more versatile than machines because they allow for more variations in range of motion. Free weights require balance, and they tend to promote more activity of the joint stabilizer muscles. Finally, they are considerably less expensive than most of the machines on the market. You can perform a complete strength training routine with a few dumbbells, and a little imagination.
Click to expand...

I can only show you a few online resources right now, I have a few books of my own with a lot of credibility that supports what all three of us have been saying, and if I find the opportunity I will give you a few references from them.

Now, your book is correct, but then again, these factors only matter if you're basically a beginner at weight lifting. A spotter really is not a big deal, most people can do without a spotter. The only time you need a spotter is if you're planning on doing negative reps or know you're going to need one to help you with your last reps if you're attempting a specific amount and you're not sure if you're going to finish. In these cases, there shouldn't be any problem getting someone to spot for you for a few reps... and by the looks of it you're doing this at a gym so there should be plenty of people for you to ask for help.

There's not much to say for myself as far as a "forum veteran" but Karky is definitely very credible and just because someone is a "forum veteran" doesn't mean what they say is more credible. Anyway, good luck with whatever you choose to do.
 
To be honest, all the reasons you quoted as to the advantages of machines are disadvantages in my eyes.

Safety. That is a really weak reason to use machines. Free weights could only be construed as unsafe to someone who had no idea what they were doing or someone using way too much weight without knowing their boundaries.

Easy to learn and use. OK, I'll give ya that. But in the end, the easier stuff will net less results. Machines are simply not functional, the fact that they are supporting the weight and controlling the movement is exactly why I don't do them! If they are doing that work, what exactly am I doing?

Machine appeal. This one is so absurd I don't have an answer to it. If people like machines because they "look cool" or are new, more power to them. You can find me over at the crusty, old squat rack.

And I still think it is a must to have deadlifts and lunges somewhere...

This is all just my opinion, based on what I have learned...
 
Wacky thanks for the information. I understand and agree with you that free weights are very beneficial. All i'm saying is that machines have their benefits as well. Now I could see your point and I'd agree with you if I was only doing machines and not free weights. But if you read through my routine its pretty evenly split between machines and free weights.

Now if you want to take the machine exercises i'm doing and substitute a better free weight exercise that would be more beneficial to me than please, by all means, do that because that is the kind of advice i'm looking for.

For example Leg press machine - what would I substitute for this? And you can do that for all the machine exercises I have just don't tell me to drop the machine exercises without filling in the gaps. I'm not saying your argument isn't credible its just you leave out a lot of info that is needed to make your statements valuable to me.
 
Thanks Mark for the post. Honestly I don't like doing lunges. I tried stationary lunges a few times with dumbells and they felt very uncomfortable for me.

Also, I understand that freeweights are more effective because they bring in many different muscles into the equation so your building a lot of muscles. However, say my triceps are flabby(for lack of a better word) and I want to exclusive focus on them to tighten them up, how is it that a machine that Isolates only the tricep so I can focus on the muscle I want to work on bad for me?
 
Well, I never said it was bad, just not optimal time spent. Again, this is my opinion. If said person had flabby tris, I'd tell him to focus on diet more anyways! :D
 
Tomahawk said:
However, say my triceps are flabby(for lack of a better word) and I want to exclusive focus on them to tighten them up, how is it that a machine that Isolates only the tricep so I can focus on the muscle I want to work on bad for me?
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Well, actually there are a few isolation exercises that basically concentrate on a particular muscle. For triceps for example, instead of the triceps press use the free weight barbell to do close-grip bench press, skull crushers/lying tricep extensions, and pushdowns. You have dips on your list, which I think is a very good exercise. If you do your squats, lunges, deadlifts, push, and pull compound exerices you won't need to do much isolation, only add in a few sets if its really keeping you back from performing your compound exercises.

Tomahawk said:
Routine 1
Chest/Triceps
Dumbell Chest Press -----> Dumbell/Barbell Bench Press
Incline bench press Machine -------> Dumbell/Barbell Incline Bench Press
Chest flys ---> :D This is good the way it is if you need variation.
Pullover Machine ---> Don't need this.

Tricep Press Machine -------> Close-grip bench press
Dips
Overhead tricep extension ------> lying triceps extension is good too.

Routine 2
Back/Biceps
Dumbell Row leaning over bench ---> :D
Lat Pull-Down ----> :D
Seated rowing Machine ----->:D

Standing Bicep curls. I mix this up. Alternating or 1 arm at a time.
Machine Arm Curls. ------> Unnecessary
Barbell Curl -----> There isn't a need for dumbell and barbell during one sessiong, alternate or change up after a period of time once you hit a plateau.
Hammer Curls

Routine 3
Shoulders/Abs
Ab crunches ---> Do weighted ab cruches
Ab machine stuff ---> Unnecessary

Overhead Press Machine -----> Unnecessary
Lateral raise
Front Raise
Shrugs ---> Try deadlift shrugs out.

Routine 4
Legs
Squats
Leg Press machine ----> I personally don't advocate it, but apparently its ok for variation if you can keep your form.
Knee extension Machine ---> Not necessary
Seated Heel Raise ----> Do standing calf raises instead
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I went through your list of exercises and I put a few suggestions as to what exercises I think would be better for you to substitute into what you have now. A few other excercises include:

Bulgarian Split Squats
Lunges
Deadlifts
Shoulder presses
Also for your abs you should work on your lower abs and obliques as well.
 
Wacky, you say that some of the exercises are unnecessary, but I enjoy taking the time to do them all. Is too much ever to much?
 
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